Videos > Israel Matters #12: Lebanon 2000: The story of how we got to where we are today Israel Matters #12: Lebanon 2000: The story of how we got to where we are today Pesach Wolicki 99 views • 1 likes 6 years ago • 32:17 min
Transcript [00:01] welcome back everyone to israel matters [00:04] i'm rabbi pesach wiliki and i'm here [00:05] once again with security defense [00:07] history expert and of course coffee [00:11] and fine meat and wine expert [00:14] elliot showdown how you doing elliott [00:16] i'm good face how are you [00:17] good later on we have to have a [00:19] conversation about proper marinades for [00:21] steaks [00:22] okay sure you have some ideas absolutely [00:25] i'd like to start just with two quick [00:27] thoughts one of them is [00:28] um the the fact that in this [00:32] deal with the emirates that we were [00:33] talking about last time i couldn't [00:35] really talk about this much today [00:36] but there was obviously the backing off [00:39] of the annexation [00:41] and it got me thinking about the whole [00:44] topic [00:45] of the nations of the world in all the [00:48] negotiations [00:49] was real since since even before the [00:51] state very interested [00:53] in dividing up the land and other people [00:56] laying claim [00:57] other nations or other groups of people [00:59] laying [01:00] claiming the pieces of the land of [01:01] israel and it seems to be very important [01:03] to many of the nations of the world [01:05] that this or that portion of the land of [01:07] israel and even the city of jerusalem be [01:09] be chopped up and divided up and a few [01:11] weeks back i shared [01:13] an interesting verse that was kind of a [01:15] cryptic verse for many centuries but to [01:17] us is simple about [01:19] actually there being a division of [01:20] jerusalem but i also wanted to kind of [01:23] encourage everyone that when we get all [01:25] worried you know as we're concerned for [01:26] israel about oh [01:28] we're giving up on our rights to this or [01:29] they're dividing up this or the other [01:31] side is going to get that [01:33] that this is all part of the prophecies [01:35] you know we can comfort ourselves even [01:37] if a negative prophecy is coming true it [01:39] comforts us [01:40] the bible is real so in the book of joel [01:43] in chapter four the book there's the [01:46] first two verses of chapter four for [01:48] behold [01:48] in those days at that time when i will [01:52] bring back the captivity [01:53] meaning the exiles of judah and [01:56] jerusalem so that's nowadays [01:57] i will gather all the nations and i will [01:59] take them down to the valley of [02:01] jehoshaphat yahushua and i will execute [02:04] justice with them regarding my people my [02:08] inheritance israel [02:09] whom they dispersed among the nations [02:11] and they divided [02:13] my land they divided my land so first of [02:16] all again [02:17] putting us back into the historical uh [02:20] viewpoint of the people who hear this [02:22] prophecy lands weren't [02:24] weren't chopped up [02:27] they were conquered and i think part of [02:28] what's interesting there is that even [02:31] today [02:31] those who want to divide the land don't [02:34] want to take it they want to divide it [02:35] and give it to somebody [02:36] else they want to chop it up right you [02:37] know because no one's interested in [02:38] dividing lines they're interested in [02:39] conquering them [02:40] and here's this prophecy again a verse [02:42] that for many centuries was quite [02:44] cryptic and to us makes perfect sense [02:46] and what's also interesting is that this [02:47] judgment takes place in the valley of [02:49] jehoshaphat now if you go back [02:50] even 150 or 200 years ago the valley of [02:53] jehoshaphat is just this [02:54] valley outside the walls of the city of [02:56] jerusalem [02:58] kind of the beginning of the of the [02:59] hills that run off [03:01] towards you know towards the west or the [03:04] northwest [03:05] uh of the of the old city and today [03:08] you look at the valley of jehoshaphat [03:10] and you say wait a second that's [03:11] actually part of the actual armistice [03:13] line between [03:15] between the state of israel and the [03:17] jordanians and what and [03:18] you know with the obama administration [03:20] declaring everything from the 67 [03:22] lines to be palestinian territory that's [03:25] actually where uh the the valley of [03:28] jehoshaphat runs [03:29] along that that armistice line so it's [03:32] another one of these things that makes [03:33] us realize that hey maybe [03:35] maybe as things progress we're [03:36] understanding these verses pretty well [03:38] now the other thing i wanted to share is [03:41] uh [03:41] last time you talked about how the [03:44] palestinians kind of blew it with their [03:45] relationship with the emirates [03:47] yes yeah about uh that aid that was [03:50] given and how this and how [03:52] and they just yeah they dissed them [03:55] yeah they dissed them and that that's [03:56] part that's probably part of what was [03:58] going on here [03:59] and this weekend in the main [04:02] i shouldn't say maine in the most widely [04:05] read israeli hebrew israeli newspaper [04:07] yudi otakrono which both you and i [04:10] uh have at our homes over the weekend in [04:12] the weekend paper [04:14] in the weekend magazine section which [04:15] has a lot of political analysis there [04:17] was an [04:17] interview with the [04:21] deputy foreign minister of the united [04:23] arab emirates who was [04:24] he was really the central figure in this [04:27] relationship with israel over the last [04:29] couple of years [04:31] and in the interview i just wanted to [04:33] obviously it's in hebrew so i'm just [04:34] going to do a free translation [04:36] of one paragraph of the interview [04:39] which kind of confirmed what you were [04:41] saying but it also took it to another [04:43] level let me just read this here for you [04:45] okay so the interviewer asks him forgive [04:47] me for taking off my glasses for a [04:48] moment [04:50] he said the peace agreement between [04:54] israel and you [04:55] meaning the emirates changed the [04:57] paradigm [04:58] in the past the assumption was that [05:00] there must be peace with the [05:02] palestinians [05:03] and then the rest of the arab world and [05:05] you have changed this [05:07] he answered he says yes we made an [05:11] independent decision [05:12] without consulting with anyone else in [05:15] the region [05:17] the idea that the palestinians need [05:20] to peace and that will follow them [05:24] would able to would would be able to [05:27] work that would work if only [05:31] they were unified but when there's a [05:34] problem with organizations such as hamas [05:38] and on the background of this lack of [05:40] agreements [05:42] that we had meaning lack of agreement is [05:45] a is a very pleasant way of putting it [05:47] that we had with the palestinian [05:50] authority [05:51] we understood that we have to move [05:53] forward [05:54] we have a real problem with the [05:57] corruption of the palestinian authority [06:00] specifically in light of our being [06:04] generous donors or he says extremely [06:07] generous donors [06:08] who want to support the palestinian [06:11] population [06:12] and not the corruption so instead [06:16] of donating more and more we decided to [06:20] think of a new route [06:22] and maybe this agreement will wake them [06:24] up [06:26] wow yeah you see you just said well to [06:29] get elliot showed up to say wow [06:31] is no is is no small thing i just want [06:34] to elaborate on your wow because i know [06:36] you and i are thinking the same thing [06:37] when i read this on shabbat i was like [06:39] whoa wait a second [06:40] it's not just that that this is in the [06:43] background [06:43] the fact that the deputy foreign [06:45] minister of the emirates is willing to [06:47] say publicly there's a problem with [06:50] hamas [06:51] and there's corruption in the [06:52] palestinian authority even american [06:55] administrations [06:56] even american administrations until the [06:58] trump administration and this includes [07:00] the bush administration includes the [07:01] clinton administration [07:02] even u.s administrations have never been [07:04] willing to to [07:06] you know call it out today to openly say [07:09] there is a problem of corruption of the [07:11] palestinian authority [07:13] there's a problem of the division [07:14] between hamas and the palestinian [07:16] authority which means that [07:17] there's no unity there and there's no [07:19] one to talk to one of the big issues we [07:21] always have with the palestinians is [07:22] that people on the left who say oh [07:25] you know give them a state it's like [07:26] give give who a state [07:28] there's about there's hamas and there's [07:30] a palestinian authority and [07:32] you know and there's the plo and there's [07:34] fatah and [07:36] so the fact that he was willing to call [07:38] this out [07:40] and say very plainly you know [07:43] we're interested in helping the people [07:45] the palestinian authority is corrupt and [07:47] we don't want to deal with them [07:48] and we're looking for a new way of [07:50] helping them [07:52] this to me uh it not only confirmed what [07:55] you were saying [07:56] but it took it to another level that [07:57] this is it [07:59] this paradigm shift is really happening [08:03] well you know what if i could break down [08:06] what he said versus [08:07] against what actually happened they send [08:10] aid to gaza we permitted it to land [08:14] and hamas refused to accept it so who's [08:18] the facilitator and who's the preventer [08:20] you right exactly right right right [08:23] so that's a good way to put it they're [08:25] not stupid [08:26] they're like you know the israelis are [08:28] willing to be helpful [08:30] and the palestinian leadership is not [08:32] maybe we've got this backwards [08:35] okay so speaking of hamas in gaza [08:37] they've been in the news this week so [08:39] right so what are your thoughts there [08:40] well um [08:42] we've got about two weeks of escalation [08:44] going on now [08:45] um with rocket fire and all sorts of [08:48] other stuff [08:49] and frankly um it's something that i [08:52] think that [08:53] we need to watch i mean i i keep an eye [08:56] on it and [08:56] like both through the news and through [08:58] contacts [09:00] but it isn't a lot to really discuss [09:02] really what do you mean [09:04] it's a concern but this is sort of the [09:06] summer heat up [09:08] uh it happens almost every year [09:11] it happens for various reasons having to [09:13] do [09:14] with hamas and its opponents and and [09:17] all sorts of stuff like that uh [09:21] but there's nothing new in this in other [09:23] words meaning if it's allergy season and [09:25] your allergies flare up [09:27] that's not a health problem that's worth [09:29] investigating well [09:30] i'll i'll take it further if it's flu [09:32] season and [09:34] you know people are getting really sick [09:36] it's it's important to address it on the [09:38] sort of on the operational level but [09:40] there isn't a deep commentary here [09:42] the weather turns the flu comes out [09:44] people get sick from it [09:49] you know so um gets active in the summer [09:51] time right [09:52] and again there are a whole bunch of [09:54] reasons maybe we can we can get to them [09:56] but [09:56] none of them are acute in the sense of [09:59] uh [09:59] they're new to the third week or the [10:02] fourth week of august 2020. [10:04] um so they don't they don't signal [10:07] anything [10:09] er that requires any real you know you [10:11] know it's just headlines it's right it's [10:13] not [10:13] really it could erupt i don't think it [10:16] will it could [10:17] um it could erupt from things that have [10:20] nothing to do with [10:22] intention um a rocket hit [10:25] a home in steroids the other night iron [10:27] dome took out [10:28] all but one and the one hit a home um [10:32] some of the balloon incendiaries [10:36] uh landed in a in an empty nursery [10:38] school [10:39] had it been filled with kids i mean [10:43] it's volatile but hey that's how we live [10:45] here [10:46] that's not that that's not in [10:49] 2020 news and it's it's not news for the [10:51] last five 10 15 20 30 years [10:53] this is just this is the chronic [10:55] situation so i think [10:57] that rather than just go back over it i [11:00] i think we need to to come up to it and [11:04] where we where we left off so to speak a [11:07] few weeks ago promising to get back to [11:09] it and then getting [11:10] preempted by beirut by an explosion in [11:13] beirut and a mate and a major paradigm [11:15] shift in the middle east right [11:16] um i think it is to go back to where we [11:19] were [11:20] follow the iran hezbollah track [11:23] uh more or less up to date and then [11:25] we'll cycle back and follow the [11:27] the palestinian element of it which [11:30] includes hamas [11:31] of course there's dovetailing and and [11:33] all of that [11:34] but when we stopped uh last time talking [11:37] about [11:37] his block last time i mean like three [11:40] weeks ago [11:41] three episodes ago yeah um [11:45] basically barack had been elected he'd [11:48] been [11:48] elected on a platform that we would be [11:51] out of lebanon within [11:53] uh within a year this was july 1999 [11:57] right and there was and there was the [11:58] popular mother's protest [12:00] the four mothers and and and a whole [12:02] pile on [12:03] um we got to get out of lebanon we got [12:05] to get out of lebanon [12:06] now the truth is that the army in those [12:08] days was also discussing [12:11] a paradigm shift in lebanon [12:14] but just to remind people to sort of set [12:17] the stage [12:18] we had a a proxy ally [12:21] in lebanon i say proxy ally because they [12:24] were doing stuff [12:25] certainly for their own benefit as well [12:27] uh an organization [12:29] called the south lebanese army it was [12:31] made up of [12:32] village militias all through the south [12:35] and i'm pretty sure i mentioned this [12:37] it's worth repeating [12:39] christian muslim shiite muslim [12:43] uh who were all interested in keeping [12:47] their villages clean these are people [12:48] who lived under [12:49] uh palestinian terrorism for decades and [12:52] they [12:53] didn't want it okay so could you explain [12:55] the relationship between the south [12:57] lebanese army [12:58] and israel because despite the name [13:01] south lebanese army [13:02] people should understand this is not an [13:04] army that represented lebanon [13:06] correct as i said it was it was a a [13:08] conglomerate of village militias [13:12] we had basically worked out with them um [13:15] you know [13:16] this is worth going back a bit when when [13:18] we first went [13:20] into lebanon in 1982 [13:23] uh the the israeli army was welcomed by [13:27] the villagers in the south and in other [13:29] parts of the country [13:30] as liberators liberating them from the [13:32] palestinian terrorist organizations [13:35] uh people were dancing in the streets [13:36] they were throwing flowers and rice at [13:38] the israeli [13:38] vehicles i mean it was it was a [13:40] celebration [13:42] what was missed and this was a major [13:43] israeli mistake at the time and [13:45] by the way it's a recurring one we're [13:47] not the first and nor the last [13:49] to have made this mistake is that you go [13:51] from liberator to occupier very very [13:53] quickly [13:56] and just because they loved you [13:57] yesterday doesn't mean they're going to [13:58] love you tomorrow [14:00] it's like okay you did the job you [14:02] cleaned them out thank you very much [14:03] goodbye [14:04] and we overstayed our welcome um [14:08] and made a number of mistakes along the [14:09] way in part because we had never [14:11] it was not a planned occupation in the [14:14] sense of there was never any [14:15] any intention to turn that [14:18] that territory into into israeli in any [14:21] way any way shape or form [14:22] it was for purely military reasons [14:27] fast forward to the 1990s basically [14:29] having learned the lesson [14:31] we left the villages in nominal control [14:33] of the villagers [14:35] uh to the extent that they had their own [14:37] militias we [14:38] armed them we trained them we uh [14:43] we paid for for for a good deal of them [14:46] but we respected them as well in other [14:49] words we didn't come through the [14:50] villages [14:51] as the army uh hey we're here we're just [14:53] coming through we would we'd ask [14:55] permission they would always say yes [14:57] in other words it was a um it wasn't an [15:00] equal relationship but it was a much [15:02] more respectful [15:03] relationship and they had their [15:04] interests [15:06] um and we supplied them heavily we [15:08] supplied them with tanks [15:10] with heavy weapons and provided them [15:12] with air and artillery support when they [15:14] needed it [15:15] as well as having our forces strung out [15:18] uh in the territory between the villages [15:20] and in outposts along the northern edge [15:22] of [15:23] what we called then the security zone [15:25] and which i've always called the [15:26] insecurity zone [15:28] now the security zone was a problem [15:32] from a tactical point of view because [15:34] when you're sitting in one place [15:36] an enemy that figures it out and because [15:38] bella did figure it out by the early mid [15:40] 90s [15:41] uh begins to take the initiative against [15:43] you sitting in one place is a bad thing [15:47] and my military students and some of my [15:50] college students have taken [15:51] those kind of courses with me know that [15:54] one of my [15:55] iron laws and i've got a number of them [15:58] is [15:58] he who sets the pace wins the battle if [16:01] you're sitting [16:02] and he's setting the pace he will win [16:06] and our sitting there in and of itself [16:10] was problematic [16:11] the roads leave it leading up to the to [16:14] supply and and [16:15] resupply and reinforce the outpost [16:17] became very dangerous [16:19] uh easily ambushed and so on [16:22] we had tragedies as a result of that [16:25] there was the [16:26] helicopter crash uh in the late 90s [16:31] 73 soldiers were killed when two [16:33] helicopters crashed [16:35] on their way up to lebanon why were they [16:37] using helicopters because the roads were [16:39] unsafe [16:41] so this is something the army understood [16:44] and one of the discussions in the army [16:46] was okay what do we do about it [16:48] and one of the solutions that was sort [16:50] of being leaned [16:51] towards was to withdraw the outposts [16:56] and not control the territory [17:01] leave the sla in place so they would [17:04] control the villages [17:05] and we would continue to operate in [17:07] lebanon without [17:08] physically sitting there in other words [17:11] sending forces in and out night day [17:13] ambushes patrols whatever [17:16] in a strategy that is best described as [17:20] denying [17:21] the territory to hezbollah rather than [17:24] controlling it ourselves okay [17:27] denial is a sort of a lower level [17:32] of control than control itself that's [17:34] also putting a lot of trust in the south [17:36] lebanese army [17:37] they had an interest they had an [17:40] interest [17:41] and we could have continued to support [17:43] them with artillery we could have [17:44] continued to support them [17:46] with air air support and if necessary [17:48] with with a [17:49] with physical support on the ground if [17:52] necessary [17:53] uh because we have the vehicles to to [17:55] get in there [17:56] not instantaneously but soon enough in [17:58] case if they came under heavy attack [18:01] barak's strategy if you can call it that [18:04] was based on a principle and i call it [18:06] the the barak doctrine [18:08] uh in hebrew is called [18:11] we're here and there there we're going [18:13] to pull back across [18:15] the line it's not really a border but [18:16] we're going to pull back out of their [18:18] territory [18:19] we're going to withdraw all support for [18:22] the sla [18:25] and we're going to be on our side [18:27] they're going to be on [18:28] their side we won't bother them they [18:31] will have no reason to bother us [18:33] and life will be beautiful peace in our [18:35] time in the middle east [18:38] now the most fundamental problem with [18:40] that plan is that barack [18:43] barack we're talking about didn't read [18:46] the large print in the hezbollah [18:49] doctrine not the small print the large [18:50] print [18:51] number one objective of hezbollah is to [18:53] destroy israel [18:55] they make no bones about it it's based [18:57] on khomeini's philosophy [18:59] they repeat it all the time and i don't [19:02] know [19:02] where he came up with this idea that it [19:04] was all about our being in lebanon [19:08] they wanted us out of lebanon for sure [19:09] but that wasn't their objective that [19:11] wasn't their grand objective [19:13] so when we pulled back and we pulled out [19:16] chris bala moved in now [19:17] in pulling and withdrawing support from [19:20] the sla [19:21] the sla collapsed [19:24] wow and they must have been treated like [19:26] traitors by hezbollah [19:28] well actually what happens is is much [19:30] more complex and more interesting than [19:32] that [19:34] we barack said we're going to be out in [19:36] a year in other words he came in in july [19:37] we're going to be out in july of 2000. [19:40] and here's another very important rule [19:41] never tell your enemy what you plan to [19:43] do [19:47] it's not that complicated and [19:50] chris correctly from their perspective [19:53] said why should we let them out in july [19:55] if we can drive them out earlier and [19:56] make it look like a victory [20:00] so they started putting pressure on the [20:03] south lebanese army [20:05] and the sla south lebanese army knowing [20:08] that it was going to be abandoned [20:10] basically collapsed in late april and [20:13] early may of 2000 [20:16] leaving our outposts completely exposed [20:22] so in a very very quickly thrown [20:25] together [20:26] uh operation although it was well [20:29] planned [20:30] quickly thrown together on the [20:31] operational level [20:33] we pulled out essentially in one night [20:36] in may 2000 and i would argue [20:40] tactically from the in the grand scheme [20:43] of things [20:45] it was one of the most brilliantly [20:46] executed operations [20:48] in idf history [20:51] uh just to give you a quick sense of we [20:55] pulled everybody out basically in one [20:57] night [20:58] we lost nobody and when i say lost i [21:01] mean it [21:02] in both senses of the term nobody got [21:04] killed and nobody got [21:06] lost and anybody who's ever traveled [21:08] with a bunch of people [21:10] uh and i'm talking about you know a [21:11] busload of 20 30 people [21:13] for a week not losing anybody is quite a [21:17] feat [21:21] not losing anybody in a withdrawal [21:23] operation at night [21:25] is semi-miraculous [21:29] and by the way withdrawal or withdrawal [21:31] and organized withdrawal is an extremely [21:33] complex operation [21:34] because you're going in the wrong [21:36] direction [21:39] okay and an advance may be difficult but [21:41] it's easily [21:42] kind of layered a withdrawal is not and [21:45] this was done [21:46] under fire because once they realized it [21:50] was happening they opened fire on [21:51] on our troops and one of the ways [21:55] not to have a withdrawal breakdown [21:58] is that you don't return fire this is [22:02] not a simple thing to do [22:04] when you're under fire and your combat [22:06] troops but if you do return fire the [22:08] first way gives away [22:09] your position and second parts of the [22:12] withdrawal will become engaged so [22:15] instead of think of a [22:16] um a balloon collapsing on itself neatly [22:19] parts of the balloon will get stuck [22:23] ah okay [22:26] and you can have units trapped that way [22:28] surrounded in other words [22:29] it becomes a a real merry mess [22:33] um so yeah without going elliott just [22:35] without going into details [22:37] yes um you were serving during this time [22:40] right yes he was [22:41] so okay you were okay so in other words [22:44] you have first hand on [22:45] knowledge of what happened here yeah i i [22:47] was um [22:48] i was actually attached at the time to [22:51] uh [22:51] the chief infantry paratrooper officers [22:55] headquarters okay [22:58] dealing in doctrine um [23:02] so on the one hand as i said [23:06] brilliant on the other hand to [23:08] paraphrase [23:09] churchill after dunkirk when um [23:13] when the word of gunkirk the success of [23:15] dunkirk was [23:16] relayed to the house of commons that was [23:18] given a standing ovation [23:20] and churchill in his inimitable fashion [23:22] got up and said [23:23] may i remind the members of this house [23:27] that wars are not won by spectacular [23:29] retreats [23:32] uh now [23:38] with the collapse of the sla 8 000 [23:41] lebanese crossed into israel with us [23:43] at the same time they fled they were [23:46] fearing for their lives [23:48] fearing for their lives and [23:51] that anticipated was that anticipated by [23:53] us nothing was anticipated [23:56] that was the whole point in other words [23:58] it happened so [23:59] fast in may that there was no no [24:02] negotiation we brought them in they left [24:04] their cars at the border they [24:05] they came across on foot we set them up [24:08] initially [24:08] in camps and then very very quickly [24:11] moved them to hotels [24:13] um there were there used to be there [24:15] were still a couple of them not too many [24:17] left [24:17] a bunch of holiday villages along the [24:19] shores of the sea of galilee [24:21] they were sort of like bungalow colonies [24:23] and they were very quickly turned into [24:25] um refugee centers they were refugee [24:29] camps in [24:30] in the sense that um that people would [24:33] imagine [24:34] people they were living in structures [24:36] and they were being taken care of and [24:38] and that sort of thing um but basically [24:41] it was okay now what do we do with these [24:42] 8 000 people and by the way [24:45] it had its own complexity we couldn't [24:47] mix [24:48] christian with muslim villages we [24:51] couldn't mix jerusalem with christian [24:53] village i mean [24:55] even though they were all serving in the [24:56] sla the villages had their own animosity [24:59] between them [25:03] it goes back i don't know about like a [25:05] thousand years or something yeah exactly [25:08] so it was an interesting period in its [25:10] own right since then [25:11] some have stayed here some have gone [25:14] back and this is part of the interesting [25:15] part [25:15] hezbollah made a point [25:19] of not taking revenge against them [25:25] and that was part of hezbollah's [25:28] political movement to get to where it is [25:30] today as [25:31] a major political power in lebanon [25:34] um supported by some of the christian [25:38] parties in other words [25:43] leadership behaved extremely [25:46] highly strategically during that period [25:51] and at the same time they drove [25:54] the christians basically had fled the [25:56] south those who didn't were driven out [25:58] of the south [25:59] the south that used to be very largely [26:01] christian during the period that we were [26:02] there [26:03] now has become entirely shiite muslim [26:05] and entirely hezbollah [26:10] during that summer of 2000 [26:14] nasrallah made a speech in binch bell [26:17] one of the major cities in the south [26:19] that we refer to as the spiderweb speech [26:22] where he said the israeli army [26:24] is a myth it's not really a powerful [26:26] army it's a spider web [26:27] all you have to do is this and it [26:29] disappears [26:33] we barack in may june [26:37] made multiple statements saying okay [26:39] we're back across the border we're here [26:40] you're there you're not going to bother [26:42] us we're not going to bother you [26:44] but if anything happens across this [26:46] border we're going to respond [26:48] with extreme violence okay [26:51] deterrence is in place [26:55] and then early in the fall a war breaks [26:58] out with the palestinians that they [26:59] launch [27:00] what is commonly referred to as the [27:02] second indi father [27:04] but which is not an intifada an intifada [27:06] is a popular uprising [27:07] this is a terrorist war that [27:11] arced upward uh into 2001 and 2002 we'll [27:15] talk about that sort of in its own [27:17] in its own context but that's the period [27:19] of the suicide bombings [27:21] uh and ultimately operations in [27:24] judea samaria and gaza [27:28] while all of that is going on the [27:32] military units that were supposed to be [27:34] holding the northern border get stripped [27:36] from the border [27:37] and sent into the territories [27:40] and from september october 2000 [27:45] until september 2005 [27:48] the northern border was not held by [27:50] israeli infantry [27:52] it was held by other troops very good [27:54] boys and girls [27:55] but not people who are training is about [27:59] holding and controlling territory [28:01] engineers [28:02] tankists pressed into infantry service [28:06] and it was not [28:07] not tanks guys from the tanks operating [28:10] as foot soldiers and i hesitate to call [28:13] them infantry because [28:14] they were operating as infantry but not [28:16] trained as infantry [28:19] and the border was basically abandoned [28:23] in that fall there was the attack um in [28:25] which three israeli soldiers [28:27] were killed and their bodies were taken [28:29] the first so-called kidnapping [28:31] and by the way here i have to say i [28:32] don't use the word kidnapping [28:34] uh gila chalit wasn't kidnapped the [28:37] soldiers in 2006 weren't kidnapped [28:40] soldiers serving in the line in uniform [28:42] are not kidnapped [28:45] they're not they're not victims of a [28:47] crime [28:49] now that doesn't mean what that would [28:50] happen to them should have happened to [28:52] them [28:53] but when you're on patrol or on duty on [28:56] a hostile border [28:58] it's your job to prevent that from [29:00] happening [29:01] nobody else is going to do that for you [29:05] but in any event there was no real [29:07] response to that [29:08] some two dozen israelis were killed [29:11] along that border [29:12] between 2000 and 2006 [29:16] and it was kept quiet [29:20] largely because the israeli government [29:22] knew that if it said or did anything [29:24] about it it would have to respond [29:26] and it didn't have the capability [29:28] because of what was going on [29:29] in judaism area and gaza and here it's [29:32] no secret [29:34] we see that today and maybe we can we'll [29:36] conclude with this and pick up [29:38] yeah yeah i mean um we see it today [29:44] the closer anything happens to the [29:46] center of the country meaning jerusalem [29:48] tel aviv [29:49] the more seriously it's taken by the [29:52] decision-makers [29:53] so rockets around the south or [29:56] fire along the northern border gets much [30:00] less serious attention than rockets into [30:03] tel aviv [30:04] or attacks around jerusalem [30:08] that was part of the reality i actually [30:09] wrote an article back then [30:11] in 2003 or so 2002 2003 [30:16] called ignoring the north in which [30:19] i can't i predicted in the prophetic [30:21] sense but predicted what was ultimately [30:24] going to happen in 2006 [30:26] uh because if you ignore it long enough [30:29] they're going to cross [30:30] cross the line and force you not to [30:32] ignore it right this sounds like a good [30:34] place to stop it's interesting that as [30:36] you're talking and i'm thinking about [30:38] what i started with with the comments of [30:40] the deputy foreign minister of the uae [30:42] about the palestinians [30:43] that it seems that [30:47] the palestinians were in a much stronger [30:49] position [30:50] diplomatically and and in terms of [30:53] you know you know geopolitically back [30:55] then than they are today [30:57] yes and uh and and maybe [31:00] you know with the words of of this [31:02] deputy foreign minister [31:04] maybe it's time for them to wake up uh [31:07] and uh and maybe there could be a better [31:09] life for them but uh [31:10] this i think it's important that [31:12] whatever happens in the news this week [31:14] elliot [31:14] that next week we pick this up because [31:16] the story [31:18] this is the real type of background [31:20] information that people need when we [31:21] watch the news [31:23] we just get you know we just get the [31:25] moment without the perspective and this [31:27] is really giving us the perspective [31:29] so again thank you everyone for joining [31:31] us ellie you wanted to say something [31:33] no just hopefully nothing that exciting [31:35] will happen in the next week [31:37] you never know you never know you never [31:41] know we'll see what happens [31:42] out there in the persian gulf or or with [31:44] iran or in syria there's [31:46] there's always fun okay everyone have a [31:49] great week and we'll and we'll talk to [31:50] you again a week from now please share [31:52] this please [31:53] please keep the comments coming uh david [31:55] nehring who commented [31:56] that we he'd like to see us go back and [31:58] pick up some of the loose [32:00] ends that's exactly what we're doing [32:01] this week we saw your comment [32:03] we plan to do that anyway but it is [32:05] important to talk about [32:06] the latest developments as well when [32:08] they matter so thank you for watching [32:10] israel matters where we discuss the [32:12] things that matter most to israel god [32:15] bless
In this episode, Rabbi Pesach Wolicki shares a fascinating excerpt from an interview with the Deputy Foreign Minister of the UAE. Then, Defense and Security expert Elliot Chodoff takes us back to 2000 to continue to understand the background that continues to impact Israel's security to this very day.
Subscribe to the newsletter A regular email of new videos and articles from across the site. To hear about this channel on its own, use Follow above.
