Transcript [00:00] Anna Kasparian got absolutely humbled in [00:03] this debate and it is incredibly [00:05] satisfying to watch. Take a look. [00:08] >> Do you put any weight behind the fact [00:10] that Bet Sullum has come out with its [00:11] own report calling Israel's actions in [00:14] Gaza a genocide. [00:16] >> Sorry, I just maybe that wasn't clear. I [00:18] put out a report critical of Bet Salam's [00:21] work. I don't multiple instances. No, [00:24] no, no. I wasn't clear, so I apologize. [00:26] >> No, that's okay. Uh, thank you for [00:28] clarifying. Second question for you is [00:30] the claim that the birth rate in Gaza is [00:34] double the Israeli kill rate of the [00:37] Palestinian people. I'm curious uh where [00:40] that citation comes from, especially [00:42] given the fact that international [00:44] journalists have been barred from [00:45] entering the Gaza Strip and reporting on [00:47] what's actually happening on the ground [00:49] there. [00:50] >> Sorry, that's from the Gaza Ministry of [00:52] Health. [00:53] The Gaza Ministry of Health says that [00:55] double the amount of people in Gaza. [00:59] >> They didn't frame it that way. They [01:01] didn't f They say around just shy of [01:02] 30,000 people were killed in 2023. [01:07] Around 20,000 were killed in 2025 and [01:11] just shy of 20,000 have been killed um [01:14] now like in 2026. So that's they put out [01:17] what's called the verified death list. [01:19] I'm sure you've covered the verified [01:20] list where they list the IDs so you can [01:23] validate whether they're legitimate IDs. [01:25] You can't validate it against the [01:26] population register because we don't [01:28] have access to that. But it seems to be [01:32] in the right sort of ballpark which is [01:34] why most people will use those numbers. [01:36] They also issue births in Gaza like any [01:38] government does and the births are [01:41] double the deaths around 50,000 births [01:44] in Gaza a year. [01:46] already your numbers are questionable to [01:48] say the least. Uh if you can recall [01:50] Israel I agreed I agree that from Gaza. [01:54] >> Okay. Well it Israel signed a ceasefire [01:57] deal with Hamas in October of last year [02:00] and since then they have killed anywhere [02:03] between 10050 to 1,290 [02:07] Palestinians not 20,000 Palestinians in [02:10] 2016 uh 2026. So I don't know. Those [02:13] numbers seem a little fishy to me, but [02:15] we can move on. Go ahead, Mario. [02:17] >> Yeah, my my point on this one as well, [02:19] Joseph, is that um if Israel So, a lot [02:22] of people like to make the argument that [02:24] high birth rate or Israel's if Israel [02:26] wants to genocide a population, they'll [02:27] just kill everybody. But, you know, this [02:29] is actually the objective is there's a [02:31] practical way of achieving it. If the [02:33] goal is to get all Palestinians out of [02:34] Gaza and to annex Gaza, the solution, if [02:37] they kill every single Palestinian or [02:39] they they try to get a a rate of, you [02:42] know, kill more people at a rate higher [02:44] than the birth rate in the country or [02:46] try to prevent births, they'll get [02:48] massive push back around the world. [02:49] They'll get, you know, their approval [02:51] ratings will collapse more than they [02:52] have already. So, I think the argument [02:54] that not enough people are dying or a [02:55] lot of people are being born doesn't [02:57] really prove that genocide is not [03:00] happening. I think it needs a lot more [03:01] than that. I think what proves genocide [03:03] is not happening is that not talking [03:04] about settling Gaza or not talking about [03:07] trying to get Palestinians as many as [03:08] possible out of Gaza, not leveling the [03:10] entirety of the country or the region. [03:12] These are better indicators. [03:14] >> Neither of those things, just to be [03:17] clear, would be genocide. If Israel were [03:19] to settle Gaza, Jews living somewhere [03:22] does not equal genocide. Similarly, if [03:25] there was a population transfer, which [03:27] has happened in many, many countries, [03:29] that also wouldn't equal genocide. You [03:31] could argue if it was against the will [03:33] of the people there, it's ethnic [03:35] cleansing, but it's not genocide. Words [03:37] have definitions. In the term context of [03:39] genocide, it has a legal definition. Um, [03:42] do speciality. Yeah. Everyone's been [03:44] over this a million times. We don't have [03:46] to rehash the genocide. [03:47] >> I hosted a debate. I hosted a debate [03:49] with two explorers that deal with [03:51] genocide for zero. I think whatever you [03:54] want to call it legally, what it's [03:55] called, what it's labeled, what do [03:57] genocide scholars call it. For me, the [03:58] term doesn't matter. versus what's [04:00] actually happening on the ground that [04:01] matters, what the intentions are. [04:03] >> So what would you call I don't want to [04:04] debate whether you call what would you [04:06] call the Minister of National Security [04:08] Bengaring [04:10] and I believe this was last week that [04:12] the Israelis should do targeted killings [04:14] of 30 to 40 Palestinians in Gaza [04:17] nightly. [04:18] >> Nightly. So, [04:19] >> uh, what would you call it, uh, when you [04:21] hear Ben Gavir, not on one occasion, not [04:24] on two, not on three, but on multiple [04:25] occasions discussing the need to [04:29] eradicate the Palestinian people in the [04:31] Gaza Strip and settle the land? I mean, [04:34] what what else would you call it? I [04:35] mean, the intent has been declared not [04:38] just by Ben Gavir, but by Israel Catz, [04:41] by Bosel Smootrich, by Benjamin [04:43] Netanyahu on multiple occasions. They [04:45] tell us exactly what they intend to do, [04:47] then they carry it out. And yet, we are [04:50] supposed to believe the gaslighting [04:52] about how this isn't about uh wiping out [04:56] a population of people from a tiny strip [04:58] of land that the Israelis have been [05:00] looking to annex and take as their own [05:03] from the very beginning. I mean, I just [05:05] it doesn't make any sense to me. They [05:07] say what they're going to do, they do [05:08] it. So why don't we actually say that we [05:11] believe the Israelis in carrying out the [05:14] atrocities that they've been carrying [05:15] out? [05:17] >> So Israel has no desire to have to annex [05:21] Gaza. You may find individuals within [05:24] Israeli politics that would like to see [05:26] that happen, but Israel has made no [05:29] statement to that effect. In fact, the [05:31] opposite is true. In 2005, Israel [05:33] disengaged from Gaza. They pulled out [05:37] every single Israeli. And since then, [05:41] Gaza was used, well, since 2007 as a [05:47] base to attack Israel from. When Fatak [05:50] were in control, that wasn't the case. [05:52] As soon as Hamas took the strip, it was [05:54] used to launch hundreds of thousands of [05:57] rockets at Israel. Now, genocide [06:02] is not I'm not trying to argue the legal [06:05] definitions of genocide. What I'm saying [06:07] is there's a clear pattern of Israel [06:10] taking tremendous risks [06:13] to its own people, to its own soldiers [06:16] to minimize civilian casualties. Why [06:19] would you empty Rafa? Why would you make [06:21] millions of phone calls? Why would you [06:23] create maps? Why would you create al- [06:25] Mawasi? And I'm not pretending that Al [06:27] Moas is a summer camp. It's hor. If you [06:29] go on Google Maps in Google Earth and [06:31] you look it, it's just tense as far as [06:35] the eye can see. And as we move into [06:37] winter, I imagine the conditions there [06:39] are going to get even worse. And half [06:41] the population is under 18. And there [06:44] are many children while Hamas may [06:46] recruit minors ch even if they're [06:48] recruited by Hamas, a child is still [06:51] innocent and their childhood has been [06:52] robbed. And the majority of children [06:54] living in Gaza aren't aren't Hamas and [06:57] they are suffering because of the war. [07:00] But Israel would not have created these [07:02] places like Al-Masi where despite Anna's [07:05] claims, Israel takes very minimal [07:09] actions there and only acts when there [07:11] is a known threat. Now I'm not going to [07:13] defend Ben Gavir's statements because I [07:14] don't support Ben Gavir. You ask me to [07:16] support Netanyahu. There's many things [07:18] Netanyahu does. I support. There's many [07:20] things he does. I don't support. Ben [07:22] Gave is not a politician that I get [07:25] behind. He said things I found [07:27] reprehensible before he came into [07:29] office. He said things that I found [07:31] reprehensible. I'm not a Beng fan, but I [07:35] do believe that even Ben Gavir is not [07:39] advocating for genocide and the total [07:41] eradication of the Palestinian people as [07:43] as you guys were trying to claim. And [07:45] I'd love to see a quote to that effect. [07:47] >> I just want to mention one statistic and [07:49] I'll go to you Anna. one statistic you [07:50] said Israelis don't want to annex Gaza [07:53] um according to multiple polls over 2025 [07:56] from times of Israel Tatika channel 14 [08:00] um 39 to 51% of Jewish Israelis would [08:04] like to annex Gaza or settle Gaza in [08:07] some form depending on which pers [08:08] between 40 and 50% that's a pretty big [08:11] number and in terms of Benge terms of [08:13] Bengavir I'll just add one more thing um [08:15] 33% of Israelis of Jewish Israelis have [08:19] a favorable view of Benv versus 64% that [08:22] have an unfavorable view. [08:24] >> He's looks to get no more than four [08:27] maximum if he was the by the highest [08:30] polls it would be 14 seats which is [08:33] >> that's in the poll based on exactly best [08:35] because they vote for other people that [08:36] prefer people to Ben but I think talking [08:38] about one in three Israelis having a [08:39] favorable view of him of someone like [08:41] this that wants crocodiles around a [08:43] prison that is building gallows to hang [08:46] Palestinians as part of the death [08:47] sentence. So, I think he I think he's [08:49] crude. Don't get me wrong. Wearing a [08:51] little hangman's noose is not a very [08:53] traditionally Jewish thing to do, but [08:56] but but he's talking about he's talking [08:58] about he's talking about terrorists and [09:02] he's talking about crocodiles round [09:04] prisons. It sounds crazy. It sounds like [09:06] something out of a super villain movie, [09:08] but this is [09:10] >> where terrorists are [09:12] >> and and I'll give you the statement. [09:13] Your statement. So, Khan used asked him [09:15] for clarification. and Benvir they said [09:17] to him your statement about 40 to 50 [09:19] killed in Gaza every day created a huge [09:21] uproar around the world. So Benvir said [09:24] they should get 40 to 50 people every [09:26] single day and execute them in Gaza and [09:28] kill them in Gaza. He replies, [09:30] "Excellent, excellent. I prefer that [09:32] they cry and that a Jewish mother [09:34] doesn't cry over her soldier son, her [09:36] soldier son." [09:38] >> Yeah. [snorts] In the same discussion uh [09:40] while arguing for expanded killings of [09:42] civilians in Gaza, Bengavir also said [09:45] that Palestinians are not worthy of life [09:47] and that they're not even people, which [09:50] is genocidal rhetoric. The other thing [09:51] that I'll just note is uh when you [09:54] implement a threemonth blockade of any [09:58] and all humanitarian aid entering the [10:00] Gaza Strip, obviously there's genocidal [10:03] intent there. That doesn't just include [10:05] food, water, it includes medical [10:07] supplies, obviously incredibly important [10:10] medications uh to keep people alive. Um [10:13] anesthesia as children are undergoing [10:16] amputations for the endless air strikes. [10:20] And just quickly going back to the [10:21] conversation about [10:23] literal homemade kites that do not have [10:26] any weapons on them whatsoever, we are [10:29] comparing kites to what the United [10:32] States has armed the Israeli military [10:34] with, including 2,000 lb bombs that the [10:37] Israelis felt the need to drop on [10:40] residential homes all throughout the [10:42] Gaza Strip, thus leveling the entirety [10:44] of the Gaza Strip. The very first sign [10:47] that the Israeli government with it the [10:50] help of its military intended to carry [10:52] out these types of atrocities was when [10:54] they forced evacuations of Palestinians [10:58] in the north to the south and then as [11:00] Palestinians made their way to the south [11:02] the Israelis bombed the south killing [11:05] the refugees as they fled. In fact, [11:07] that's precisely the reason why Hind [11:09] Rajab's family who was from the north [11:12] had evacuated to the south and then when [11:14] they saw that the Israelis are bombing [11:16] Palestinians in the south, they went [11:17] back to the north. Israel goes back to [11:19] bombing the north. At that point, [11:21] Hindraab along with her relatives get in [11:23] a car to try to flee the north, back to [11:25] the south. I mean, this went on and on. [11:27] And during that moment, as they were [11:29] fleeing, uh the IDF decides to um carry [11:32] out an attack on their vehicle, killing, [11:36] you know, uh what was it, five of her [11:38] relatives. At that point, her cousin was [11:40] alive. Uh but as the cousin was on the [11:43] phone with the Palestinian Red Crescent, [11:45] begging for help, you could literally [11:47] hear IDF forces uh carrying out shelling [11:50] of the vehicle, killing the cousin. And [11:52] then as we all know later, 3 hours [11:55] later, after the IDF was made very clear [11:59] that there was a little six-year-old [12:01] girl trapped in that vehicle, they [12:04] decided to approve an emergency vehicle [12:07] to uh approach to save Hindraab. As it [12:10] got closer, they killed the emergency [12:12] workers, two of them, and then they [12:13] killed Hindra. This is the behavior that [12:16] we have seen again and again by the IDF [12:18] in the Gaza Strip and it has been [12:20] replicated in other parts of the Middle [12:23] East including southern Lebanon. And so [12:26] when you have Israel cats declare out [12:28] loud overtly that we are implementing [12:31] the Gaza strategy, the Gaza model in [12:34] southern Lebanon, and then you see the [12:37] IDF literally wipe out 24 villages in [12:40] southern Lebanon, including Christian [12:42] villages, that tells you everything you [12:44] need to know about the intent of the [12:45] Israelis here. In my opinion, [12:51] >> it basically comes down to numbers, [12:53] Anna, because [12:55] the numbers don't lie. The numbers do [12:58] not lie. [12:58] >> I agree. I agree. [13:00] >> And there's a population of 2 million in [13:03] Gaza. [clears throat] [13:04] There is a population of 2 million or [13:06] there was before the war. And [13:11] despite Gaza being one of the most [13:14] densely populated places in the region, [13:17] despite it being [13:20] a sealed cage, [13:23] Cece locked the bar. I don't know if [13:25] you've ever seen the Egyptian border, [13:26] but it's rows and rows and rows of fence [13:30] with wire. And Cece on October the 8th [13:32] refused to let one Palestinian cross the [13:35] border. Now, many did because they paid [13:38] a $10,000 bribe or more to escape a war [13:41] zone. So, Israel [13:45] was forced to fight on those terms. We [13:48] had no choice but to go to war with [13:50] Hamas. They launched the war on October [13:52] the 7th. I can see you smoking, but I [13:54] think we would both uh opposed to [13:57] Hamas's actions on October the 7th. Is [13:59] that fair? We're both against their [14:01] atrocities. thought was an act of a [14:03] gross act of human rights, abuse, [14:05] violation, war crimes, whatever you [14:07] genocidal intention. Would you agree [14:10] with that? Just to make sure we're on [14:12] the same page there. [14:13] >> I would I would say, you know, for [14:15] because this is a typical trick of um is [14:18] Israel's proponents to immediately go to [14:20] do you condemn Hamas? But here's the [14:22] thing. You [14:23] >> I'm just I'm just October the 7th. [14:25] >> Let me ask you a question. You of course [14:27] have no problem condemning what Hamas [14:29] did in targeting civilians on October [14:32] 7th, but you can't condemn the targeting [14:35] of civilians on one side while defending [14:38] the targeting of civilians by the [14:40] Israeli forces on the other side because [14:43] they have [14:43] >> I'll be I'll be really clear. So any [14:47] soldier, so I'm trying to answer. Any [14:49] Israeli soldier that has intentionally [14:53] killed civilians, I condemn. Now, [14:57] tragically in war, civilians die. That's [14:59] why wars are horrible. You can't fight [15:01] an enemy, an army, a terrorist group [15:04] without, and I hate the term being [15:06] collateral damage. But you cannot find a [15:09] war in history where that hasn't [15:10] happened. Now, Israel has a very strict [15:13] rules of engagement. You can't simply [15:17] shoot to kill in most instances. You [15:20] need to get clearance. If you're doing a [15:22] drone strike, there needs to be [15:23] clearance. And so, Israel developed [15:25] strategies like knocks on the roof. So, [15:28] if Israel is going to hit a building, [15:31] they will do their utmost to ensure [15:33] civilians aren't there. They send text [15:35] messages. You've seen them on the phone [15:37] to Palestinians and Palestinians begging [15:39] them not to hit the building in this [15:41] war. They will then send text messages. [15:44] They will drop flyers. They will create [15:46] maps and warn the enemy of a pending [15:49] incursion, a pending military action, [15:51] which no military does because you lose [15:53] your competitive advantage. You lose [15:55] your surprise um element of any attack. [15:57] If you tell Hamas that we're coming in [15:59] three days time, Hamas knows you're [16:01] coming in three days time and can either [16:02] ambush or flee. So from a military [16:04] perspective, it's a terrible strategy, [16:06] but Israel does it to minimize civilian [16:09] casualties. You mentioned [16:12] Sorry, you Yeah. No, no, you're going to [16:15] Is that how No, I was just going to [16:16] respond to that by asking, is that how [16:19] you describe double tap strikes on [16:22] hospitals after first responders show [16:24] up? Is that is that the kind of [16:26] >> I'll add I'll add one more I'll add one [16:27] more to this one, Joseph. I'll add I'll [16:29] add one more to it, Joseph. And as you [16:30] know, you know my stance, it's like [16:32] twoonone. So, I apologize for that. But, [16:34] you know, [16:34] >> it's okay. I'm used to it. With Jews, [16:36] it's it's it's much more than two on [16:38] one, unfortunately. I wouldn't I [16:40] wouldn't say with Jews, but just when it [16:41] comes to Gaza, if we're talking about [16:42] Turkey, etc., it' be a lot more [16:44] balanced. Um, another example is the [16:46] statements by K just about a week ago um [16:48] saying that he's proud, he's happy that [16:51] the homes are being destroyed in [16:52] Lebanon. The homes will remain [16:53] destroyed. Rebels should remain there as [16:55] a message to everyone else not to mess [16:57] with Israel. Um, these don't seem the [17:01] intentions of a of a of a military that [17:03] has very clear rules of engagement. [17:06] So they they do have very clear rules of [17:08] engagement which is why the civilian [17:09] death toll in Lebanon is relatively low [17:12] comparative but why level why level the [17:14] homes? Why intentionally level all the [17:16] homes? Not infrastructure, all the [17:18] homes. [17:19] >> Any building that has strategic [17:22] advantage toah [17:24] will be targeted has been targeted. If [17:27] it's been used to attack if it's being [17:29] used to provide damn cover if it [17:31] conceals a tunnel, they will be they [17:33] will be targeted. Now, I would much [17:35] rather say and I I'm not going to sit [17:36] here and pretend that Israel doesn't [17:38] destroy buildings. You can go on Google [17:40] Maps. You can look Gaza 11,000 in [17:43] Lebanon 70 and and in Gaza 70 to 80% of [17:46] the buildings have been damaged or [17:47] destroyed. There's no argument from me. [17:49] My argument isn't that. My argument is I [17:51] would rather see 70 to 80% of the [17:53] population live which they do. 70,000 [17:57] people have been well 73,000 according [18:00] to Hamas have been killed in Gaza. That [18:02] includes all the militants. That [18:04] includes natural deaths which was around [18:06] 8,000 a year prior to 2023. And if [18:10] anything, natural deaths would have [18:12] increased because things like medical um [18:15] supplies are are not as available as [18:19] they were before the war. Hospitals [18:21] aren't as operational. Basic sanitary [18:23] things like water. Israel provides a [18:25] huge amount of the water to Gaza. [18:26] Something, by the way, a nation that [18:28] wanted to genocide a population wouldn't [18:30] do. You wouldn't provide them with [18:31] water. But [18:32] >> they've controlled the water flow into [18:34] Gaza. They've controlled it. This is the [18:36] beginning. They of course Israel [18:38] controls the flow that comes from Israel [18:40] into Gaza. But why would do you think [18:42] the British were supplying the Nazis [18:44] with water in World War II? Do you think [18:46] they've provided them with 2 billion kg [18:48] of [18:48] >> the Palestinians in Gaza prior to [18:51] October 7th? [18:52] >> They would uh carry out a policy of [18:54] mowing the lawn essentially going in and [18:57] just slaughtering Palestinians here and [18:59] there just to show them you know who's [19:01] boss. I mean [19:02] >> one of the things I struggle with you is [19:04] you [19:04] >> has been so evident and look you you [19:07] have an do you ever different role of [19:09] defending the barbarism that we're [19:11] talking about right now you don't have [19:13] to do you ever differentiate between [19:15] Palestinians and Hamas this because you [19:17] ask me about civilians okay because you [19:20] say things like no the law and [19:22] >> yeah in classified [19:25] >> classified IDF data that analyzed [19:28] internal and classified Israeli military [19:30] intelligencea databases found that named [19:34] combatants, named Hamas combatants, [19:37] accounted for about 17% of the total [19:40] recorded fatalities in Gaza. Just 17% of [19:44] the people that they killed, the IDF was [19:47] able to name as combatants, the rest [19:49] civilians. Other uh studies into the [19:52] number of people killed in Gaza show [19:54] that 60% upward of 60% women and [19:57] children. And so [19:59] >> 60% of women and children [20:00] >> 60% women and children. Yes. [20:02] >> So what do you this comes back to what [20:04] do you consider what do you consider to [20:06] be a child? So for instance I mentioned [20:07] the report I did on Betelum. You had [20:10] people like Ban and Bani Mata big beards [20:12] 17 year olds in the shahada posters with [20:15] M4s with big Kalashnikov rifles and [20:18] they're considered children. Who do you [20:20] consider just because somebody is 17 [20:22] years old, which by the way many western [20:24] armies recruit 17 year olds for [20:26] frontline roles. Just because someone is [20:29] under 18, it does not mean they are [20:32] innocent. Just because someone is a [20:34] woman, it might shock you to know that [20:36] Hamas actually also use women. It's as [20:40] feminist as they are, they use women. So [20:42] just because someone is a woman and just [20:44] because someone is under 18, it does not [20:47] mean they were complicit in the war. [20:50] There's always an obedient excuse about [20:51] how they're allegedly Hamas militants or [20:53] if they're not Hamas militants, oh, [20:55] Hamas was using that them as human [20:57] shields. Look, when um the IDF's own [21:00] internal classified analysis of those [21:03] they killed in Gaza indicates that they [21:05] are only able to name 17% of them as [21:08] Hamas combatants. That tells you [21:10] everything you need to know about what [21:12] the civilian kill ratio really looks [21:14] like in Gaza. I I I don't know what else [21:16] to tell you. I'm basing this off of the [21:18] IDF's own internal data and their own [21:21] analys. The IDF have stated that they've [21:24] killed around 30 to 35,000 [21:28] terrorists. Not 17% 30 to literally [21:31] Netanyahu is on record saying this. Of [21:34] course, the Amazon records saying all [21:35] sorts of things that are not true. But [21:38] this is based on again the IDF's [21:41] internal data and classified analysis of [21:45] >> the IDF has never said they've killed [21:46] seven. You misunderstand the statistic [21:49] that you're quoting. What that quote [21:51] says, okay, you don't. Okay. What's it [21:53] saying? Is it saying that is Israel [21:55] saying they've only killed 17% of the [21:57] deaths civilian? Sorry, terrorists. Is [22:00] that what you think it's saying? I just [22:01] want to be really clear. Is that what [22:03] you're saying? [22:04] >> Of the 73,000 individuals that have been [22:07] slaughtered in Gaza, the IDF was only [22:09] able to name 17% of them as Hamas compat [22:14] combatants. [22:15] >> And if you guys want to know more [22:16] details about that, please go ahead and [22:20] report the original report which was in [22:23] 72 magazine. Please read it for [22:25] yourself. [22:26] >> Abraham released it. So, what I was [22:28] going to say is when Israel strikes, [22:30] let's say you have a terror cell and [22:31] they're about to launch a rocket and [22:33] they know that there's five terrorists [22:35] there that are firing the rocket and [22:36] they hit that strike. There is no way of [22:39] confirming the identities of those [22:41] people in that moment. You can't go in [22:43] and take a DNA swab, take it back to the [22:45] lab, match it up to your DNA database of [22:48] every Hamas member. Of course not. What [22:50] they're saying is when there's a shahada [22:52] poster released, the kind of post we're [22:53] mentioning, or when they have [22:54] identification of a high-profile target, [22:57] etc., these are the ones that have been [22:58] named there. They are by no way in any [23:01] stretch saying these are the only [23:03] terrorists they've killed. It's an [23:05] absurdity. In no war will you ever be [23:07] able to find any military that's able to [23:10] say definitively, here are the 100% [23:12] combatant names of the people we killed [23:15] in Afghanistan. I push it back to you, [23:16] Anna. Name me any military campaign [23:19] where you've been able to to to name the [23:22] people of the opposing army that you [23:24] have killed. Name any conflict where [23:27] that's happened. It's an absurdity. [23:30] >> The kill ratio in Gaza is unusual and [23:34] unprecedented [23:36] in regard to the 5:1 ci civilian to [23:40] combatant kill ratio. [23:41] >> How did you get the 5 to1? So just from [23:44] based on your own data you're basing [23:48] this on Hamas. [23:50] >> No, I'm basing this off of the IDF's own [23:52] data. And by the way, I mean, when when [23:54] you see the images, the aerial videos of [23:58] the Gaza Strip and you see the entire [24:00] Gaza Strip flattened, are you really [24:02] going to try to make the argument that [24:04] the civilian kill ratio in Gaza is [24:07] something that the IDF should write home [24:09] about as if it's something to be proud [24:11] of? [24:11] >> Okay, perfect. So let's just quickly [24:13] home in that two seconds. [24:14] >> In in Rafa in Rafa there were over a [24:16] million Palestinians in Rafa before we [24:18] went in. Yes. [24:19] >> Do you agree with that? [24:21] >> It was where they [24:22] >> Okay. That that was the fact that many [24:24] many that were displaced from the many [24:26] that were displaced from the north moved [24:28] south to Rafa. They thought it was the [24:29] safer place. They went south. Israel [24:31] America then put huge pressure on Israel [24:34] not to go in to Rafa. There was the all [24:37] hand all eyes on Rafa campaign. I'm sure [24:39] you remember it. Israel eventually did [24:41] empty Rafa and thankfully if they did [24:44] because that's that where we eliminated [24:46] Sino but there were over a million [24:48] people there. Rafa today go on Google [24:50] maps have a look. It's not there. It's [24:53] been raised to the ground and I there's [24:55] no argu I'm not going to I'm not I'm not [24:58] proud of this. I'm not happy about this. [24:59] This is a horrible reality of war. What [25:02] I am relieved to see what I am relieved [25:04] to see is the million people that were [25:06] in those buildings are not in those [25:08] buildings. Tragically, they're now [25:10] intense in Al-Masi, but they're [25:12] breathing. And thank God they're [25:13] breathing because we don't want to see a [25:16] genocide. We don't want to see two [25:17] million dead Palestinians, 2 million [25:19] dead Gardens. If we did, we'd do it in [25:22] an afternoon. But we [clears throat] [25:23] don't. And we risk our own children to [25:26] minimize those civilian casualties. Why [25:28] are there troops on the ground in [25:29] terminus? Why are there troops on the [25:31] ground in Gaza? [25:32] >> We don't need troops in Gaza. [25:34] >> No, we don't need troops in Gaza. We can [25:36] control it from the air. You can just [25:37] carpet bomb. Every soldier there is a [25:40] potential dead Israeli because they are [25:42] being attacked on a daily basis. The [25:45] reason they're there is to minimize [25:46] civilian casualties. Why facilitate the [25:49] movement of aid? Why do all of these [25:50] things if we wanted to genocide and [25:53] slaughter as you put it? You make no [25:55] differentiation between a civilian and a [25:57] combat. [25:59] >> Absolute round of applause for Joseph [26:02] Cohen in this debate. Uh she is [26:04] insufferable. So talking to her is like [26:08] just surviving a conversation, listening [26:10] to her, uh, you know, makes you want to [26:12] kind of claw out your ears. Um, but [26:15] Joseph Cohen, you know, I have to give [26:17] him props for understanding exactly how [26:19] to refute each one of her points. And [26:21] she was increasingly angry. You saw how [26:24] she literally almost had smoke coming [26:26] out of her head as this debate [26:28] continued. Um, you know, and and I think [26:32] that, you know, this, you know, I have [26:34] to give props even to the host. This is [26:36] a much better format than Piers Morgan. [26:38] Piers Morgan, the people go on, it's [26:42] very hectic. It's too many people. It's [26:43] very hard to get a word out. And here, [26:46] despite the fact that there is some [26:48] screaming and there is some, you know, [26:49] shouting over each other, it's a much [26:52] more controlled environment where ideas [26:54] can actually get discussed. So, I think [26:56] Zionist pro-Israel influencers should [26:59] rather go on his show where there'll be [27:02] more ideas discussed as opposed to just, [27:05] you know, literal gollop literal, you [27:08] know, f Israel, you know, and people [27:10] cursing and and just not worth watching. [27:14] Thank you for watching this video. For [27:16] more, subscribe to the channel. You can [27:18] also go to Joseph Cohen Israel Advocacy [27:21] Movement on YouTube and Instagram. [27:24] And uh hopefully we won't have to cover [27:27] any more Anakasparian debates because I [27:28] don't want to watch her smug face any [27:31] longer. Again, thank you for watching [27:33] and I'll see you in the next one. [27:36] [music] [27:43] >> They voted in Hamz knowing [music] what [27:45] Hamas are. [27:46] >> Hamas gave no warning before they [27:47] slaughtered 1,300 women and children. [27:50] >> October 7th has happened. [28:02] Okay. [28:02] >> Kill the Jews. [28:04] >> Killing Jews with Israel.
