Transcript [00:00] I think even a lot of Christians don't [00:01] realize that that's the meaning of the [00:03] term Pentecost that that it originates [00:05] in the Old Testament, originates in the [00:07] in the Hebrew Bible. [00:09] But what I as someone who works in the [00:12] field of Jewish-Christian relations, as [00:14] the rare rabbi who reads the New [00:16] Testament, [00:18] I was always struck by the overlap in [00:20] theme [00:22] between these two days. And I think we [00:23] talked about this a couple years ago. [00:25] And this is where reading Acts chapter 2 [00:27] becomes very interesting. Welcome to [00:29] this episode of Shoulder to Shoulder, a [00:31] podcast where a pastor and a rabbi get [00:33] to the heart of issues that matter to [00:34] people of faith. I'm Pastor Doug Reed [00:36] here with my friend Rabbi Pesach [00:38] Wilitzki, and on this episode we're [00:39] going to be having a conversation all [00:41] about the holiday of Shavuot or [00:44] Pentecost. Before we jump into our [00:46] conversation, please like our Facebook [00:48] page and join our Facebook group, the [00:49] Shoulder to Shoulder community, where [00:51] you can interact with Pesach and me all [00:54] week long. The best way to support this [00:56] podcast is to go on over to Patreon, [00:57] subscribe to our Shoulder to Shoulder [00:59] page, and for just $10 a month, you're [01:01] helping us bring this message of [01:03] Shoulder to Shoulder to more and more [01:04] people all around the world. As a thank [01:06] you for your $10 subscription, you get [01:08] exclusive access to chapter-by-chapter [01:10] Bible study beginning in Genesis chapter [01:12] 1 from Rabbi Pesach and myself. So, go [01:14] on over to Patreon, subscribe to [01:16] Shoulder to Shoulder for just $10 a [01:18] month. We're grateful for our sponsor [01:20] Israel 365 News, which is the place for [01:23] you to go and get your news and [01:24] information before going to anyone else. [01:26] Go on over to Israel the numbers 365 [01:29] newsin.com [01:31] to check out some of their articles and [01:32] be sure to read Rabbi Pesach and my [01:34] columns. Pesach, Israel 365 always has [01:37] incredible products and initiatives that [01:39] they are supporting. What are we [01:41] highlighting this week? [01:43] Well, we're highlighting an event that's [01:44] actually taking place on the day this [01:47] podcast is being released. So, if you [01:48] are listening to this podcast on [01:50] Wednesday, May 20th, there is still [01:53] time, as long as you're listening to it [01:54] in in morning, there is a webinar that [01:57] we are hosting today. Israel 365 Action [02:00] is is hosting a webinar. I am the host [02:03] and moderator. [02:05] And the title is will America first [02:08] stand with Israel exploring the [02:10] complicated relationship between the [02:11] America first movement and Israel as it [02:13] currently stands. And we have three [02:15] incredible panelists. Josh Hammer, [02:17] senior editor at large at Newsweek and [02:20] host of the Josh Hammer show on the [02:21] Salem network. Dr. David Wurmser, who's [02:24] also been on the podcast a few times, [02:25] senior analyst for Middle East affairs [02:27] at the Center for Security Policy. And [02:29] Pastor Rob McCoy, who is the senior [02:32] pastor of uh Godspeak Calvary Chapel out [02:35] in California and the co-founder of [02:37] TPUSA Faith. And really what he's messed [02:40] what he's best known for is that he was [02:42] Charlie Kirk's pastor, Charlie Kirk's [02:44] spiritual mentor, very close with him. [02:45] They would travel together a lot. And he [02:47] has his finger on the pulse of the state [02:50] of the America first movement. So that [02:51] webinar is happening Wednesday, May 20th [02:53] at 1:00 p.m. Eastern time, 8:00 p.m. in [02:56] Israel. [02:57] If on the other hand, the webinar has [03:00] already happened when you're listening [03:02] to this podcast and you can't sign up [03:03] for it, you can still go to the Israel [03:06] 365 Action website and we will be [03:09] posting clips from the webinar there. [03:12] We're also going to be posting segments [03:13] from the webinar on the Israel 365 News [03:16] YouTube page, [03:18] our YouTube site. And uh it's going to [03:20] be a great webinar or it has been a [03:22] great webinar depending on when you are [03:23] listening to it. The way you you can [03:25] register is go to Israel 365/America [03:28] First. Uh or click and the you know, [03:31] we'll put the link in the description of [03:32] this podcast. We'll put that in there. [03:34] So you can click on it to register for [03:36] this webinar. So that's Israel [03:38] 365/America [03:40] First as one word. [03:42] Excellent. Make sure you go and if you [03:44] miss it, go check out the clips. [03:47] Well, Pesach, I am in a hotel room. I [03:49] feel like we're uh switching lives a [03:51] little bit. Normally you're the one uh [03:52] in hotel rooms more often than not, and [03:55] here I am sitting in Bowling Green, [03:57] Ohio, because the Reeds have begun our [04:00] traveling adventures. And you're back in [04:02] Ohio. You're back in Ohio. You spent [04:04] many years there. [04:06] >> I did. We spent the better part of a a [04:08] decade almost 10 years uh in Youngstown, [04:10] and yesterday was my first time back in [04:13] the pulpit at Bridge of Hope since we [04:15] left as pastors. [04:17] >> Ooh. [04:18] It was It was a little emotional. I got [04:20] to be honest. It was a little surreal. [04:22] And even on the drive in, my wife gets a [04:25] little anxious before events. I do the [04:28] crash after the events. So, leading up, [04:31] I'm anticipating. I'm like, this is [04:33] good, high energy. And then once it's [04:35] done, I'm like, let me sleep. Let me go [04:37] have a nap. I just I kind of come down. [04:40] She's the the opposite. So, I don't know [04:42] if we balance each other out or we just [04:44] stay uh in that, you know, space. But we [04:47] on the drive, honestly, we we're sitting [04:49] there. She had a moment where she was [04:51] like, wow, this is really emotional. I [04:52] didn't know I'd be so emotional. Like, [04:54] we're going to see people that we've [04:55] talked to and text and all of that. But [04:57] everybody was so excited, not just to [04:59] see us, but for all that God is doing, [05:02] uh excited to help us get to Israel and [05:05] uh raise some support for us. So, uh [05:08] Saturday we started with a vision [05:10] breakfast where we had about 50 people, [05:12] and we got to share uh our heart for [05:15] Israel. We got to share our journey for [05:17] those that didn't know it. Kind of the [05:19] 2016 trip all the way through to our our [05:21] current state uh where we're headed to [05:24] Israel in a year from now. And everybody [05:26] was so excited, engaged, lots of great [05:29] questions, and [05:30] >> [clears throat] [05:31] >> the kids each shared. It was awesome. [05:33] So, I I have a question. Just to make [05:35] sure our newer listeners know, [05:38] a few years ago, the Reeds moved to [05:40] Buffalo, New York, to uh to take over [05:43] the Tabernacle Church and to work with [05:45] uh with Bishop Robert Stearns. And [05:46] before that, for many years, you were [05:48] the pastor of Bridge of Hope in [05:50] Boardman, Ohio, which in Boardman is [05:52] part of the greater Youngstown area. [05:54] And this was your first This was your [05:56] first time back there, right? [05:58] Almost in 4 years. [06:00] Wow, that's quite something. Amazing. [06:03] >> Yeah, and so it was a lot of familiar [06:04] faces. It felt really surreal, but we [06:07] very much enjoyed uh being in [06:11] uh Youngstown, and then last night, [06:13] after the service, I drove out to [06:16] Bowling Green because the Ohio Ministry [06:18] Network is having their Ministry Network [06:20] conference, and it was a chance to [06:22] network with some pastors and see some [06:23] friends I haven't seen in a while. And a [06:26] good friend of ours, you've been in his [06:28] church, uh Michael Leger got ordained [06:30] last night, and I got to be there with [06:32] him and uh be part of the team that [06:34] prayed for him as he was uh commissioned [06:36] fully uh as an ordained pastor within [06:39] the Assemblies of God, and so [06:40] >> Wow, you know like Leger. [06:43] And And Michael Leger pays a he plays a [06:46] very critical role in the history of [06:48] Shoulder to Shoulder because the very [06:51] first recordings we ever did when we [06:53] were just kind of testing the waters to [06:55] see if we wanted to do this podcast, to [06:57] see if we knew what we were doing at [06:58] all, which we didn't. We had no idea [07:00] what we were doing. We We got together [07:03] at Michael Leger's church in Warren, [07:06] Ohio, uh in this studio space he had set [07:08] up, and we recorded some conversations. [07:10] That was the beginning of Shoulder to [07:11] Shoulder. In fact, the famous photo for [07:13] all you Shoulder to Shoulder listeners, [07:15] both the photo of us recording in a [07:17] studio setting on the Facebook page, and [07:20] the famous iconic photo, which is the [07:22] logo of this podcast on all podcast [07:24] platforms, [07:25] those photos were taken at Warren, Ohio, [07:28] on the property of the River Church, of [07:30] Michael Leger's church there. So, that's [07:32] cool that you got to see Michael. I hope [07:34] uh [07:35] I hope my name came up. You know, good [07:37] friend of mine. [07:39] Good to see him, uh I'm sure. So, uh So, [07:42] Doug, this is this is huge, and now you [07:44] So, you guys have hit the road and [07:45] you're and you're spreading the word [07:47] about your about your move to Israel. [07:50] Just one last question before we move on [07:52] to our main topic today about this visit [07:54] back to Bridge of Hope. So, you saw all [07:55] these people that you had shepherded for [07:57] years that you had been involved in [07:58] their lives, you had been their pastor. [08:00] And now you've been away a number of [08:02] years. [08:03] Did you have any uh [08:06] any positive or negative without naming [08:09] names? Was there anything that you saw [08:10] in in your flock that had changed in [08:13] them that that made you think or made [08:16] you notice something? [08:18] You know, we got to pray for a number of [08:20] people and it was really honestly it was [08:23] all really special and really good. [08:25] Everybody who showed up was excited to [08:27] see us. Anybody who didn't want to see [08:29] us took a Sunday off. So, [08:31] you know, for that standpoint, you know, [08:33] obviously some people were sick or [08:35] weren't there, but [08:36] you know, we had our people there and [08:39] the people that were there were very [08:40] excited to see us. A lot of people came [08:43] and made sure they were there because [08:45] Pastor Doug and Sam were coming back. [08:46] So, it was incredible. [08:48] In the midst of that, we have launched [08:50] our YouTube channel, which is amazing. [08:53] The kids are loving it. We've been [08:55] recording little video snippets in the [08:56] car and videos here and there and so we [08:59] have two videos up and a third video [09:01] will drop after this trip to Ohio is [09:03] complete. And the kids are loving it. [09:05] They're eating it up and they're sharing [09:07] their thoughts and it it'll be very [09:09] interesting. They're learning how to [09:11] edit video and I'm sure some of it won't [09:13] be great and some of it'll be awesome, [09:14] but the kids are enjoying it, which is [09:17] my goal with it. I really wanted to give [09:18] them another skill set and a way to tell [09:20] our story and they're embracing it full [09:23] stop, which is fun. So, let's make sure [09:25] to put the address of your YouTube [09:28] channel of the Reed family YouTube [09:30] channel in the description [09:31] >> The Reeds Are Here. The Reeds Are Here. [09:34] >> put it in there. So, we'll add it to the [09:36] description of podcast, and we'll add it [09:38] to the description of on the YouTube [09:40] version of this podcast, and let's get [09:43] some more traffic. So, Shoulder to [09:44] Shoulder listeners, go over to the [09:47] YouTube channel, The Reeds Are Here. [09:50] The Reeds Are Here, and follow the Reeds [09:52] journey. Amazing. [09:54] Amazing. Well, it is coming up to [09:57] Pentecost and Shavuot. It's going to be [09:59] a great weekend, Pesach, and we have [10:01] lots to talk about. [10:03] There's so much in the holiday that [10:06] Christians don't understand. They think [10:09] that Pentecost started in Acts chapter [10:11] 2, and we've talked about this before. [10:14] So, if you're a Shoulder to Shoulder [10:15] listener, we we did an episode a while [10:17] back where we dove into some of this a [10:20] few years ago, but we wanted to come [10:22] back into it and really unpack Acts [10:24] chapter 2 with a Jewish lens. And so, [10:27] Pesach's been studying, he's been [10:29] reviewing, and we are going to dive into [10:31] a conversation on Shavuot and the [10:34] backdrop for Acts chapter 2. So, if [10:37] you're a Christian listener, tune in, [10:39] get your Bible, pen, and notebook cuz [10:41] you're going to learn a few things that [10:43] it's going to make this Sunday more [10:45] meaningful for you. And if you're a [10:46] Jewish listener, you're going to get [10:48] some insights into the Christian view on [10:51] Pentecost and learn a few things about [10:53] Christians. [10:55] There you go. [10:56] So, let's start before we get to Acts [10:58] chapter 2. Let's just start with, you [11:00] know, with Shavuot and what it is [11:02] because it's often called, I mean, the [11:04] name Shavuot is kind of a boring name. [11:06] It just means weeks, and that's why it's [11:09] often called the Feast of Weeks, and it [11:10] gets its name from the 7 weeks of [11:15] counting of counting days that are [11:17] mandated in the book of Leviticus [11:19] between the first day of Passover as we [11:22] interpret it. The literal [11:25] words of the text say from the from the [11:27] morrow of the Sabbath, but our [11:30] traditional understanding and our Jewish [11:32] understanding, is that the Sabbath in [11:34] that verse contextually is actually [11:36] referring to the first day of Passover. [11:38] So, we count from the evening after the [11:41] first day of Passover is day one, and we [11:43] count 49 days, that's 7 weeks, that's [11:46] what the Bible commands [11:48] in the book of Leviticus. [11:51] And then, at the end of that is this [11:54] other festival. It's the only festival [11:55] that is not given a date in the Bible. [11:57] It doesn't say on the on the X day of [11:59] whatever month, on the you know, like [12:01] for example, [12:03] you know, the Feast of Tabernacles is on [12:04] the 15th day of the 7th month. And [12:08] and Passover is on the 15th day of the [12:10] first month. You know, holidays are [12:12] named festivals are named are are given [12:14] dates [12:17] in the Bible, but this one is not. It's [12:19] only [12:20] at the end of a 49 days of counting, 7 [12:23] weeks of counting, the 50th day becomes [12:25] this festival day. So, it's obviously [12:27] tied directly to Passover. [12:29] But it And it also doesn't say what it [12:31] commemorates. This is another [12:32] distinction between Shavuot and the [12:34] other pilgrimage festivals. Passover [12:36] obviously commemorates the Exodus from [12:38] Egypt, that's very explicit in the [12:39] scripture [12:41] in terms of the event and the date and [12:43] everything that we do commemorates that. [12:44] Tabernacles doesn't commemorate an [12:46] event, but it commemorates the sojourn [12:49] in the desert that God had us dwell in [12:53] uh in these huts, in these temporary [12:55] dwellings that are are called sukkot or [12:57] translated as tabernacles. That's what [12:58] we dwell we dwelt in in the desert, and [13:01] it in some way commemorates that [13:02] journey. So, it's given a reason that's [13:05] historically linked. Shavuot is given no [13:07] such reason. However, if you kind of do [13:11] the math and look through the text and [13:13] figure it out, and our sages did this [13:14] thousands of years ago, you realize that [13:17] Shavuot actually coincides with the day [13:20] that the Torah was given on Mount Sinai. [13:22] The famous scene in Exodus chapters 19 [13:25] and 20, the 10 Commandments being given, [13:27] the revelation at Sinai, the covenantal [13:29] moment [13:31] at Sinai is what Shavuot commemorates. [13:35] Which is interesting in and of itself [13:37] that the that A, there is no festival [13:41] explicitly named for this monumental [13:45] event, which is I mean next to the [13:47] Exodus from Egypt, it's the other [13:48] nation-forming event of the Jewish [13:50] people of the nation of Israel, and [13:52] there's no festival for it. Well, [13:53] there's a festival for the fact that we [13:55] lived in huts, okay? So, the fact that [13:57] there's no explicit festival for that, [13:59] and then you have Shavuot, which doesn't [14:01] have an explicit festival mentioned, and [14:02] then you figure it out and you realize [14:04] it's the same festival, that's an [14:05] interesting that's an interesting detail [14:07] of it unto itself. [14:09] And there's a lot about Shavuot that is [14:11] like that that [14:12] it depends on interpretation. [14:14] And the way I always understand that is [14:16] that God was kind of sending us a [14:18] message that when it comes to Shavuot, [14:20] when it comes to the receiving of the [14:22] Torah, receiving of the covenant of the [14:24] law, [14:26] we need to do work. And we even need to [14:28] do work to understand what the [14:29] festival's about. So, we need to [14:31] interpret and figure it out, what what [14:33] is this date really, what exactly [14:35] happened on that day? So, there's a lot [14:37] of interpretation that had to go into [14:39] determining that Shavuot is the day of [14:42] the giving of the Torah on Sinai, but [14:43] that's a universally held position. And [14:45] again, you can figure it out actually if [14:47] you read through the text carefully and [14:48] look at, you know, the dates that are [14:49] mentioned of when these things happen, [14:51] because it does say the date that they [14:52] arrived at Sinai in Exodus 19, and and [14:55] then there's the whole preparation [14:56] period for a few days in Exodus 19, and [14:59] then you eventually get to the [15:00] revelation on Sinai a few days later. [15:02] So, it works out that it's Shavuot, or [15:04] maybe it's a day off, it's basically the [15:06] right time for the giving of the Torah. [15:09] Now, [15:10] this day, which is the reason it's [15:12] called Pentecost, penta is the is the [15:15] prefix that means 50, because it's the [15:17] 50th day after Passover. I think even a [15:20] lot of Christians don't realize that [15:22] that's the meaning of the term Pentecost [15:24] that it originates in the Old Testament, [15:26] originates in the in the Hebrew Bible. [15:30] But, what I as someone who works in the [15:33] field of Jewish-Christian relations, as [15:34] the rare rabbi who reads the New [15:36] Testament, [15:38] I was always struck by the overlap in [15:40] theme [15:42] between these two days. And I think we [15:43] talked about this a couple years ago. [15:45] And this is where reading Acts chapter 2 [15:47] becomes very interesting. [15:50] Well, Pesach, before we [15:52] before we jump to Acts chapter 2, [15:54] you know, during for those that don't [15:56] know, during Passover, you get rid of [15:58] all the the leaven, you prepare for the [16:01] Seder. That there are certain things [16:03] that are prescribed to celebrate the [16:04] holiday. During Sukkot, you have to eat [16:07] in your sukkah, you you construct a [16:09] sukkah, there's certain parameters in [16:11] how to do that and what you do [16:13] within the sukkah. [16:15] What do you do for Shavuot? What's the [16:18] what's the prescription for the holiday? [16:20] What are the practices of the holiday [16:23] for a Jew? That is a great question [16:26] because [16:28] the truth is, in terms of biblical [16:32] mandates, like eating matzah and getting [16:34] rid of your leaven on Passover or [16:37] sitting, you know, dwelling in the [16:39] sukkah, eating in the sukkah on [16:40] Tabernacles, there is nothing like that [16:42] for Shavuot. There is no biblical [16:45] commandment on the individual for [16:47] Shavuot other than to make the [16:49] pilgrimage to Jerusalem, which is, you [16:51] know, is only applies when the temple is [16:52] standing cuz it's it's a pilgrimage to [16:54] the temple. We don't have a temple now. [16:56] But, there actually is no ritual [16:59] practice of any sort. So, there are [17:01] customs that people do these days for [17:03] Shavuot. The main custom, the main [17:05] observance in Jewish communities today, [17:08] and it was always practiced by some [17:10] people, but it didn't really become [17:11] widespread really until the 20th [17:13] century, [17:14] is [17:16] whole communities, [17:18] I would even say in the Orthodox [17:19] community it might even be a majority of [17:21] people stay up all night long studying [17:24] Torah. So it is very common [17:27] that synagogues, I'm sure if you check [17:28] the you know the local synagogues in [17:30] Buffalo or wherever you happen to be on [17:31] your journey, local you know Orthodox [17:34] synagogues will have all night Torah [17:36] study [17:37] and classes being given. So there will [17:39] be a class at 1:00 in the morning and a [17:41] class at 2:00 in the morning and a class [17:42] at 3:00 in the morning and people [17:44] studying in partners or studying on [17:45] their own. People will stay up the [17:47] entire night studying Torah. So So [17:49] generally what happens in in in most [17:51] communities is there's the evening [17:53] service to bring in the festival just [17:54] like you have on any Shabbat or festival [17:57] in the synagogue. People then go home, [17:58] eat dinner and then after dinner they [18:00] come back to the synagogue for all night [18:03] long Torah study. [18:04] And that will go till till dawn and then [18:07] prayers will happen at dawn and then [18:08] people go to sleep. Now, I personally do [18:11] not do this. I did it a I did it when I [18:13] was young for many years. [18:15] I myself am a very light sleeper and I [18:17] have a hard time making up sleep later [18:19] in the day if I don't sleep at night. So [18:21] a long time ago I stopped doing this. [18:24] I do stay up later than usual studying [18:27] Torah and you know I might sleep for [18:29] just a couple hours and then go back to [18:30] the synagogue to join everyone for the [18:32] sunrise service. Not everyone stays up [18:35] all night. In every community there's [18:36] people who it's just physically not [18:38] healthy for them or they can't. [18:40] But it's a very widespread practice to [18:41] study Torah all night long [18:44] to have you know extra Torah study [18:46] because it's the day that we received [18:48] the Torah on Mount Sinai. But there's no [18:50] biblical commandment. Now, one [18:53] the one biblical commandment that makes [18:56] Shavuot really unique but it's kind of [18:58] been lost on us because it only applies [19:00] in the temple. [19:02] It has everything to do with the leaven [19:03] on Passover and this is really [19:04] interesting. And even most even a lot of [19:06] Jews if you ask them about what you know [19:08] the Shavuot practice is is kind of off [19:10] the radar again cuz it's in the temple [19:12] times and we don't do it anymore. And [19:14] that is that all year long [19:16] in the temple, none of the [19:20] uh flower-based products, none of the [19:22] meal-based products were leavened. [19:25] And that's right at the beginning of [19:26] Leviticus when it speaks about the meal [19:27] offerings, it says that none of them [19:29] were allowed to be leavened. The [19:30] showbreads on the famous uh you know, [19:34] table with the 12 showbreads, we kind of [19:35] picture them as big fluffy loaves, they [19:37] were not. They were unleavened bread. [19:39] There was no leavened bread in the [19:41] temple. [19:42] Except [19:44] except [19:46] on Shavuot. [19:48] On Shavuot [19:50] and only on Shavuot, there's a biblical [19:52] mandate, a biblical command to bring two [19:55] leavened loaves as an offering into the [19:58] temple. [19:59] Two leavened loaves. [20:00] It's the exception to the rule of [20:02] leaven, meaning leaven generally cannot [20:04] be an offering to God, that's explicit [20:06] at the beginning of Leviticus, except [20:08] this this one exception. [20:10] Is the leavened loaves on Shavuot. [20:17] Well, I think that they're an allusion [20:19] to the two tablets. [20:21] Uh [20:21] you know, that that you know, the giving [20:23] of the two tablets on Mount Sinai and we [20:25] we read these two loaves and bread [20:27] represents human uh human agency and [20:30] human ingenuity. If you think of what [20:32] goes into making a loaf of bread, [20:33] there's no way an animal could ever make [20:35] a loaf of bread. An animal could eat a [20:36] tomato or a or a a fruit off a tree [20:40] because that's just [20:42] food in its basic form. If you look at [20:44] at wheat and then you look at a loaf of [20:47] bread, the number of steps and the [20:49] amount of technology and human [20:50] involvement that are required are much [20:53] greater. So, we view bread as kind of a [20:56] special food because it involves, you [20:59] know, human beings taking God's creation [21:01] and developing it and making it and [21:03] making it into something. And that's and [21:06] that speaks to our covenantal [21:07] relationship with God where God created [21:10] the world. God is the master, but God [21:13] then gave us a mandate. And that that's [21:16] what we're really celebrating on [21:17] Shavuot. During Passover, during the [21:19] Exodus story, we were kind of passive. [21:21] God did all the work. It was a sound and [21:22] light show and we were kind of along for [21:24] the ride. We were being redeemed by him. [21:27] But on Shavuot is when we take [21:28] responsibility for ourselves or or or [21:31] for God's mandate. We That's when we [21:32] take on the mission that God has given [21:34] us to be a kingdom of priests and a holy [21:36] nation, which brings us to the [21:38] overlapping theme with the with the [21:40] Feast of Pentecost. [21:41] Yeah, so Acts chapter 2 and for many in [21:45] Pentecostal churches, it's where we get [21:47] our name from is Acts chapter 2. I [21:49] happen to be in an Assembly God church [21:52] in context, which is part of the [21:53] Pentecostal movement, the broader [21:56] Pentecostal movement and it comes from [21:58] this passage in Acts chapter 2. Just a a [22:01] setup for those that don't know, you [22:03] have the four Gospels, Matthew, Mark, [22:05] Luke, and John, that tell the story of [22:07] Jesus, his death, burial, and [22:08] resurrection. And ultimately at the end [22:11] of that, Acts picks up the story with [22:14] his ascension into heaven. That's how it [22:17] begins in chapter 1. And they the [22:20] disciples there are waiting in in [22:22] Jerusalem at the command of the Lord [22:24] when he goes into heaven and that's [22:26] where chapter 2 picks up the story. So, [22:30] Jesus is now out of the picture, [22:31] ascended into heaven. The disciples have [22:33] been told to go and wait in Jerusalem [22:36] that they're going to receive this power [22:38] from on high and in verse 8 of chapter [22:40] 1, it says, "You will receive power to [22:43] be my representatives or my witnesses in [22:46] Jerusalem, Judea, Samaria, and to the [22:48] ends of the earth." Uh and I I love that [22:51] portion of scripture because it really [22:53] uh you know, the mandate of the church [22:55] is not and I say this often in the [22:59] context that I live in, it's not to make [23:01] converts. It's to represent the work of [23:03] the Lord and I think that's a really [23:06] interesting distinction for the church, [23:08] especially in our modern evangelical [23:11] context. Nowhere does Jesus use the word [23:14] converts. He constantly says, we're here [23:17] to represent, we're here to be his [23:19] ambassadors, Paul says, and I think that [23:21] that carries a different weight than [23:24] going around making converts. It adds a [23:26] different layer to the conversation and [23:29] so then in Acts 2, they're given this [23:32] power on the day of Pentecost. [23:35] Yeah, it's so important that context. I [23:38] hadn't even picked up on that from Acts [23:40] chapter 1, which is the setup for Acts [23:42] chapter 2, that they're being they're [23:44] being empowered, quite literally. [23:46] They're being empowered to go out on the [23:49] mission of spreading the gospel to the [23:50] ends of the earth, to all nations and [23:52] all peoples. [23:54] And [23:55] the So here I'm I'm going to make my [23:57] Jewish listeners uncomfortable in a in a [24:00] good way when I talk about the [24:03] incredible parallels with the scene at [24:06] Mount Sinai cuz in [24:09] chapter 19 of Exodus, which is the [24:12] chapter right before the 10 [24:13] Commandments. It's really the setup of [24:15] the entire covenantal scene, God opens [24:18] that scene by telling Moses to tell the [24:20] nation of Israel that he will become [24:22] that they will become for him a kingdom [24:24] of priests and a holy nation. And I talk [24:26] about this phrase all the time, Doug. [24:28] You've probably heard me mention it a [24:29] thousand times already. But kingdom of [24:31] priests is a mandate. It's a It means [24:34] that the people of Israel are meant to [24:36] have a priestly role in the world. The [24:39] flock, if they're the priests, the flock [24:41] is of course humanity. And that [24:44] universal mission of the people of [24:45] Israel to spread blessing to all the [24:48] families of the earth to use the phrase [24:50] from from the from the blessings of [24:52] Abraham, [24:54] this is this comes to its fullest [24:57] expression [24:58] at the revelation at Sinai where all of [25:00] the people of Israel, they all hear the [25:03] the voice of God. Moses emphasizes this [25:05] in the book of Deuteronomy when he's [25:07] reviewing the Sinai scene [25:11] in Deuteronomy chapters five and and [25:14] six, four, five, and six in that area [25:16] there where he's talking about what [25:17] happened at Sinai. When Moses is talking [25:19] about it, he emphasizes to the people [25:21] that each and every one of you heard the [25:22] voice of God that the entire nation was [25:25] told in Exodus. The entire nation heard [25:26] the voice of God. [25:28] And that parallel, [25:31] it's it's clear to me [25:34] that all of the Jewish people who were [25:37] present in Acts chapter one and two, the [25:39] author of the book of Acts, all the [25:43] people around there, they were [25:45] extremely cognizant. I mean, they were [25:48] Jews. They were practicing Jews. They [25:49] were observing Jews. They were living in [25:51] an entirely Jewish context and it was [25:54] Shavuot. It was the festival which is [25:57] all about [25:59] entering into this covenant of [26:02] relationship with God where you become [26:04] his messenger, you become his agent in [26:06] this world as a bearer of the covenant. [26:09] You take on the responsibility to spread [26:11] knowledge of God to all the families of [26:12] the earth. The parallel is obvious to [26:14] me. [26:18] You know, in the Midrash talking about [26:22] the [26:23] the revelation at Sinai. This appears [26:25] also in the Talmud, but it's more it's [26:27] more fully fleshed out in the Midrash, [26:29] same time period and some of the same [26:31] names come up. There's long portions of [26:34] the Midrash that say all sorts of wild [26:36] things about what happened at Mount [26:37] Sinai. [26:38] And one beautiful Midrash states that [26:43] every word spoken to God at Mount Sinai [26:47] split into [26:50] It [26:51] languages and it was heard in all 70 [26:53] languages. [26:54] This is a midrash. It appears both in [26:56] the Talmud and in the midrash. [26:59] And that brings to mind what happens in [27:01] Acts chapter 2. [27:03] Because in Acts chapter 2, all of the [27:04] people become empowered with the spirit [27:06] of God and suddenly, and this takes [27:09] center stage and a lot of people are [27:11] confused about it, that [27:13] all the people who are present, well, [27:15] you know, Doug, maybe we should back up [27:16] and you can tell the story of exactly [27:18] what happens in Acts chapter 2. [27:20] Sure. And I was wondering if you wanted [27:22] to go verse by verse, that might be a [27:24] little heavy for uh It might be a little [27:25] heavy. Just tell the story. [27:27] But, you know, essentially, they're [27:29] there and they go back to the upper room [27:32] in Jerusalem. It's a lot of times we [27:34] take our tours there and have a little [27:36] moment of prayer. But, they have this [27:38] moment and it says that when the day of [27:41] Pentecost had fully come, they were [27:44] there in that place and then there were [27:46] some things that happened suddenly. [27:48] Suddenly is an interesting word [27:49] throughout the book of Acts. Anytime [27:51] something happens suddenly, God's [27:53] shifting the story or shifting the [27:54] narrative or showing up in a powerful [27:56] way. And so suddenly there comes a sound [27:59] from heaven and there's a bunch of [28:01] imagery. There's tongues of fire, [28:03] there's wind, there's [28:05] all of this that whether or not you say [28:08] it physically happened that way, whether [28:10] there were little tongues of fire on [28:11] their heads or whether it's symbolic and [28:13] the writer's using [28:15] big language like this to describe it. [28:18] And they were all filled with the Holy [28:19] Spirit and they begin to speak in other [28:21] tongues and there's this crowd there [28:23] that hears and everyone is able to hear [28:27] people speaking in different languages, [28:29] but they're able to understand them in [28:31] their own language because it's a [28:32] festival. You had people from all over [28:35] the the Roman world at the time coming [28:37] to Jerusalem to [28:39] you know, fulfill the pilgrimage and so [28:41] there they were hearing the prayers and [28:45] whatnot. Actually, there's a really [28:46] funny moment in the midst of this [28:48] narrative where people are like, "Are [28:49] these guys all drunk?" [28:51] And then someone's like, "No, no, no, [28:53] it's it's the morning. If it was the [28:54] afternoon then I I just love that. [28:56] They're like, 'What's the morning? No [28:57] one would be drunk at this time. But if [28:58] it was later in the afternoon, maybe.'" [29:00] I would chuckle at that, the way the [29:02] author writes it. And and it goes on and [29:05] then uh Peter stands up and talks [29:07] because that's who Peter is. Uh when you [29:09] read the New Testament, I I always love [29:12] Peter gives me hope because these [29:14] amazing thing happen uh you know, things [29:16] happen in his life and then he has to [29:17] stand up and open his mouth. So, it [29:19] gives hope for me. Uh he's constantly [29:21] inserting his foot in his mouth. And I [29:23] think that's who God chooses to build [29:25] the church with uh because you look look [29:27] look, there's this bold brash guy. He's [29:29] going to say some of the wrong things. [29:31] He's going to deny Jesus in a really big [29:34] moment. But when Acts chapter 2 shows up [29:37] Peter's the one who's like, "Hey, let me [29:38] tell you what's going on here." And he's [29:40] going to preach from the prophet Joel [29:42] and say that, you know, this is [29:43] happening in your hearing in the last [29:45] days, I'll pour out my spirit on all [29:46] flesh. Your sons and daughters will [29:48] prophesy and your old men will dream [29:50] dreams. [29:52] And and he gives this discourse and then [29:54] in in chapter 3 you have this uh kind of [29:57] moment of large people saying, "Hey, we [30:00] want to we want to follow uh the [30:02] teachings of Jesus." And and you have [30:04] the beginning of the church. A lot of [30:06] people refer to the day of Pentecost as [30:08] the birthday of the church. And so, [30:11] that's Acts 2 in in a nutshell without [30:13] going kind of verse by verse and and [30:15] deep into it. But I think I think the [30:18] beginning part is interesting cuz I [30:19] think there's some parallels to uh the [30:23] day of uh [30:26] the giving of the Torah at Sinai. And [30:28] one of the things that we always uh [30:31] catch and teach, and I don't know if you [30:32] caught this when you read it, Pesach, [30:34] but at Mount Sinai, when the law is [30:37] given, Moses comes down and has to deal [30:40] with the golden calf and 3,000 people [30:43] die. And one of the things that's [30:44] emphasized by the author is the number [30:46] 3,000 because at the end of Peter's [30:49] message on the day of Pentecost, it says [30:51] that 3,000 people were added to the [30:55] church that day, that were added to the [30:57] the followers of Jesus. [30:59] Uh and there's certainly parallels in [31:00] numbers, there's parallels [31:02] uh with some of the things that are [31:03] taking place. [31:05] And it it really is uh this Sunday will [31:08] be I'll be in a church in Pennsylvania [31:10] this Sunday and it will be Pentecost [31:12] Sunday. It will be a little more uh [31:14] energetic and people will be praying for [31:16] the pouring out of God's spirit and his [31:18] empowerment to be his representatives on [31:21] the earth. [31:23] I tell you the the parallels [31:26] it's very interesting to me [31:28] because [31:30] the responsibility [31:32] of every person of faith, Jewish [31:37] within Judaism, we see ourselves as [31:39] having responsibility. Within [31:40] Christianity, [31:42] hopefully, I mean, people see themselves [31:44] as having a responsib- a responsibility [31:47] to spread faith to everyone else, to [31:49] spread faith to the entire earth. Now, [31:51] in Judaism, I I'm always bemoaning the [31:53] fact [31:54] that because we spent 2,000 years being [31:58] uh chased around and persecuted and no [32:00] one was listening to what we had to say, [32:02] the Jewish people culturally [32:07] kind of forgot that we have that [32:09] universal mission. It because again, [32:12] it's very easy when you're just circling [32:13] the wagons and trying to survive, it's [32:15] very easy to forget that you have a [32:16] universal mission, but it's so clear [32:19] both from the biblical text, kingdom of [32:21] priests, and from the Midrash and the [32:23] rabbinic teachings about it, that every [32:25] word of the Torah was actually spoken in [32:27] 70 languages for the 70 nations of the [32:30] world. And everyone's given this mandate [32:33] to go out and spread it. And it's so [32:37] obvious. Once you see that, you can't [32:39] unsee it. It's so obvious that the New [32:40] Testament writers, the founders of the [32:43] church, [32:44] in their Jewish mindset and Jewish [32:46] context, were building they were using [32:49] they saw Shavuot or Shavuot became in [32:52] this moment that they experienced. I [32:54] don't want to, you know, belittle what [32:55] happened here. Like you say, maybe it [32:57] was symbolic, maybe they're using it, [32:58] maybe it actually happened literally [33:00] that way. It doesn't really matter. This [33:02] is the sacred text for Christians. This [33:03] is the story. [33:05] And [33:06] but it's obvious that there's this [33:07] overlap, there's this parallel, that [33:09] this is it's one thing to have the [33:13] origins of the faith where some [33:14] miraculous thing happens, Passover, but [33:17] there's something else to be given a [33:18] mandate, marching orders to go forward. [33:22] And there's another interesting parallel [33:23] that I just thought of as you were [33:24] talking. In Deuteronomy chapter 5, which [33:28] is [33:29] the [33:30] the review of the Sinai scene. I [33:33] mentioned before chapter 4. It doesn't [33:34] It's not really in chapter 4, it's in [33:35] chapter 5. I'm always bad with chapter [33:37] numbers in the Bible. I remember exactly [33:39] where things are, I just don't always [33:40] remember the chapter number. But right [33:42] in chapter 5 in Deuteronomy, when Moses, [33:45] this is 40 years later, and he's [33:46] recounting the scene at Sinai to the [33:49] people, he uses the word fire over and [33:53] over and over again. [33:54] For example, starting in verse 3 there, [33:57] "It's not with your fathers that that [34:00] the Lord made a covenant, for to you he [34:04] made the covenant to you who are alive [34:05] today. Face-to-face, the Lord spoke to [34:08] you from the fire." [34:11] And then it says, "I was standing [34:13] between the Lord and you on that day to [34:15] tell them what the Lord said, for you [34:16] were afraid because of the fire." [34:19] And over and over again, then it brings [34:21] it it mentions the Ten Commandments. [34:24] And then it goes right back into [34:25] mentioning the word fire over and over [34:27] again. [34:28] Verse 21, and you said, we, you know, [34:31] the Lord has shown us his glory and his [34:34] greatness, and we have heard his voice [34:36] from within the fire. We've heard his [34:39] voice from within the fire. [34:42] And then, the next verse, why shall we [34:44] die if the fire consumes us? Over and [34:47] over again. And then, the next verse, [34:49] is there any people of flesh who have [34:51] heard the voice of the living God [34:53] speaking from the fire? [34:56] Over and over again, the word fire [34:58] appears. So, this association with fire [35:01] and the revelation of God's word is [35:04] right there in the book of Deuteronomy. [35:05] It's right there in the Sinai scene. And [35:08] then, the in the New Testament, in this [35:10] Pentecost scene, empowering all the [35:12] people with the spirit of God so that [35:15] they can go out and preach faith in in [35:17] the God of Israel to the nations of the [35:19] world, to the to all the peoples of the [35:21] earth, [35:22] that empowerment also again comes [35:24] through fire. The parallels just keep [35:25] going and going. [35:27] Well, and you mentioned that verse in [35:29] Deuteronomy about being a chosen nation, [35:31] a a royal priesthood. And actually, in [35:33] Peter's epistles later, uh he very [35:36] explicitly gives that mandate to the [35:38] church, that we are to uh in other [35:41] words, represent God to the whole world, [35:44] and to take the the message of Jesus to [35:48] India, and Africa, and and some of the [35:50] apostles, even, you know, the early [35:52] after this moment, you have, you know, [35:55] Thomas is recorded as having walked all [35:58] the way to India. And they have churches [36:00] all along the way. It's really [36:01] fascinating. Actually, in uh Iraq, [36:04] before the Iraq war, Nineveh, uh where [36:07] Jonah went, was uh you know, a a bastion [36:11] of faith and God-fearing people. And [36:14] Thomas is said to have shown up there. [36:17] Uh and I've heard this story from a [36:18] number of different pastors that served [36:21] in uh in that region at different times. [36:23] Uh Canon Andrew White, who we had on the [36:25] podcast, uh shared a little bit of this [36:27] journey, but Nineveh was a church that [36:30] was started in like 60 because they they [36:33] look at Thomas and say, "Well, Thomas [36:35] came through here and finished the story [36:37] that Jonah started to tell us." And [36:40] it's really fascinating when you look at [36:42] some of that, but what the the [36:44] propulsion of the church, I don't I [36:46] don't know how anybody doesn't look at [36:49] uh the church. I think even uh [36:51] Maimonides made the point that, you [36:53] know, God used Christianity to spread [36:56] the knowledge of God to the whole earth. [36:58] And the fact that, you know, this [37:00] moment, this catalyst moment in the [37:02] beginning of Acts, the birth of the [37:03] church, the idea that we should [37:05] represent God to the four corners of the [37:07] earth, uh you know, is really uh [37:10] uh as you're saying, is really uniquely [37:13] uh for people of biblical faith because [37:15] the knowledge of God covering the earth [37:17] like waters cover the sea. Uh that's not [37:19] going to happen because it should. It's [37:20] going to happen because people of faith [37:23] go out into the world and shine their [37:24] light and serve people and represent [37:26] well and do uh the good things that God [37:29] commands us to do and carry uh the [37:31] messages of scripture and Torah and and [37:35] for Christian of Jesus. Uh and I I think [37:38] it's such a [37:40] when I look at the church and I look at [37:41] how fast it spread across the earth, [37:44] it's only because of a catalyst moment [37:46] like this where you understand I have [37:48] been empowered to represent God on the [37:51] earth. And what a holy responsibility [37:54] that is to do that well. And the church [37:57] has not done that well. We could we [37:59] could tell some stories. Um the church [38:01] has been horrible at certain points in [38:03] history where they've [38:04] in in their zeal have been misguided and [38:08] done atrocities and terrible things in [38:10] the name of God, and that has uh hurt [38:13] the the mission of the church to [38:15] represent God well on the earth. And so, [38:17] we we could do a whole other episode on [38:19] that, but I think the zeal nonetheless [38:21] comes from uh this place, however [38:24] misguided it has been throughout [38:25] history. I think when it's used in the [38:27] right context and the right place, it [38:30] really propels the work of God forward [38:32] to cover the earth with knowledge of God [38:34] like waters cover the sea. [38:36] Yeah, Doug, that's beautiful. And you [38:38] know, just my final thought on this is [38:40] that we have to remember that you know, [38:43] every festival has its theme. [38:46] And the theme of Shavuot, and I believe [38:49] just reading Acts chapter 2, the theme [38:51] of Pentecost for Christians ought to be [38:53] the taking of responsibility for all of [38:55] us. Jew or Christian, whichever festival [38:57] we're celebrating, they're coming with a [38:58] very similar message that we have [39:00] responsibility to [39:03] lead, to be spokesmen for God. We are [39:06] all empowered with that, meaning we're [39:08] not we're not a faith where it's just [39:10] the clerics or the people at the top or [39:12] the prophets. [39:13] That's the message of what happens at [39:14] Sinai, and that's what Moses emphasizes [39:16] to the people. Every one of you heard [39:19] the voice of God. You don't rely on just [39:21] some prophet, and he's the one who heard [39:22] the voice of God. Every one of you heard [39:24] the voice of God. And that's the same [39:25] thing that happens in that scene in Acts [39:27] chapter 2. I know there's a lot of Jews [39:28] who are getting uncomfortable [39:30] in this conversation. A lot of Jews get [39:32] uncomfortable when we start pointing out [39:33] parallels between Judaism and [39:34] Christianity, [39:35] but we have to understand that this is [39:37] the Jewish roots of Christianity. The [39:39] The Jewish roots of the Christian faith [39:41] are not just about pieces of history. [39:43] They're also about the themes and the [39:46] messages and the symbols that are being [39:48] used by those writers who were Jews. [39:50] They were educated Jews who were raised [39:52] and lived their lives as Jews. So, the [39:56] the whole framework of their thinking [39:58] about faith and about God and about [40:00] these matters comes from a Jewish [40:02] context, and the more you learn about [40:03] that Jewish context and what they were [40:06] thinking about, talking about fire and [40:08] 70 languages, these are things that that [40:10] are that relate to Shavuot in Jewish [40:12] text, and they transfer seamlessly into [40:16] the very themes of Pentecost. So, as a [40:18] final question to you, and we can end [40:20] the podcast with this, [40:21] how do Christians celebrate Pentecost [40:24] other than maybe going to church? Cuz I [40:27] know what you do for Christmas, [40:29] that's definitely out there and and it's [40:31] pretty well known. Are there any [40:32] specific uh [40:34] I don't know, rituals or ways generally [40:36] that Christians will mark Pentecost and [40:39] and celebrate it in a way that's [40:42] different from other festivals? [40:44] So, depends on which denomination you're [40:46] in. Some denominations [40:49] are successionist. They they believe [40:51] that the Holy Spirit and the gifts of [40:54] the Holy Spirit and the empowerment of [40:55] the Spirit is a was for the church age [40:59] and the beginning of the church and no [41:00] longer takes place today. And obviously, [41:04] I'm in a Pentecostal denomination. We we [41:06] believe that God is still interacting [41:08] with his people and is still [41:10] pouring himself out. And so, typically, [41:12] most Pentecostal churches will do an [41:15] added emphasis of prayer this week. They [41:18] may have extra worship space and they'll [41:20] usually take a time in their services or [41:23] have a special time to anoint people [41:25] with oil [41:27] and pray over them for the pouring out [41:30] of God's Spirit and his empowerment. The [41:32] the message is all of the theme will be [41:35] your responsibility to be an image [41:39] bearer, be a representative, be an [41:40] ambassador for [41:42] the kingdom of God on the earth. And so, [41:45] uh you know, in that sense, there's not [41:46] necessarily uh us Pentecostals aren't [41:49] good at our traditions or our liturgy. [41:51] So, everybody kind of mix and matches [41:53] and and chooses their own their own [41:55] adventure. But, I would say for the most [41:57] part, there's going to be some sort of [41:59] emphasis on empowerment and there's [42:01] going to be a time of laying on of hands [42:03] and [42:04] you know, a an empowerment in the spirit [42:06] to go and carry [42:08] the flame of God well. [42:10] Beautiful. One final final short point. [42:13] Our producer Scott is telling me that I [42:15] have to say this. When I mentioned [42:17] earlier that there are no offerings in [42:19] Temple that are leavened, someone is [42:21] going to bring up the fact that the [42:22] Bible mentions loaves of bread that are [42:25] part of a Thanksgiving offering. But, [42:28] let me clarify. [42:29] Those loaves of bread were not brought [42:31] as an offering to God. They are just [42:33] eaten with the Thanksgiving offering as [42:36] part of it. They're kind of waved as [42:37] part of the ceremony and then eaten by [42:39] the person who brings that offering and [42:41] whoever he invites to the feast. They're [42:43] not brought as an offering to God unto [42:45] themselves. So, my point remains that [42:47] the only offering brought into the [42:48] Temple as an offering to God that is [42:50] leavened is on Shavuot. That's just a [42:52] little little uh footnote to what I said [42:55] earlier. [42:57] Absolutely. And this has been so good. [42:58] And if you want to, you can go back [43:00] almost 200 episodes to episode 40 when [43:04] we talked about this before on audio. [43:07] So, [43:07] >> Wow, that long ago. [43:08] >> this, we I think we dove a little bit [43:10] more textually into Acts chapter 2 and [43:13] into uh Shavuot during that episode. So, [43:18] episode 40, if you want to go back and [43:20] listen to some uh beginning thoughts [43:23] early on in the podcast. It may not be [43:26] uh as good as we just did here because [43:27] it's 200 episodes ago, which is crazy to [43:30] me that we've been doing it this long. [43:32] But, as always, it's fun and I love [43:35] this. Please keep tuning in. Thank you [43:37] for listening to today's episode. If you [43:40] enjoyed this episode, please like, rate, [43:42] and share this podcast. Come on over to [43:43] Patreon. Come on over to Facebook. Like [43:46] our page. Join our group. All the things [43:48] that you need to do to stay connected. [43:49] And please stop by and watch us on [43:51] YouTube. Go to Paysach Wulliger on [43:54] YouTube. There is a Shoulder to Shoulder [43:56] uh playlist that you can catch some of [43:58] the most recent episodes. And we will be [44:00] putting more and more of those on [44:02] YouTube. So, thank you, Shoulder to [44:04] Shoulder family. We love seeing you each [44:06] and every week. And we'll see you on our [44:07] next episode.
