Transcript [00:00] These pro Hamas students were not ready [00:02] for Ben Shapiro. Absolutely savage. Take [00:05] a look. [00:06] >> How much do you think is enough? Like [00:08] you said, we probably set Iran back by a [00:12] few years, but it seems the economic [00:15] pressures and do you do you think it's [00:19] necessary to put boots on the ground? [00:21] >> No, I've never made the argument that we [00:22] ought to put boots on the ground. I've [00:24] never made that argument not a single [00:25] time. Uh what what I will say is that [00:27] there are a few options and I've spelled [00:28] out the options on my show many times [00:30] that I see for the Trump administration. [00:32] Option number one is that you basically [00:33] maintain the economic strangle hold over [00:34] Iran and then you wait for some sort of [00:36] seismic shock to topple the regime. [00:38] That's that's certainly a possibility. [00:39] The other thing which I've been [00:40] advocating since April. I think the big [00:41] mistake in the Iran war was stopping. I [00:44] think that we should not have paused. I [00:45] think the pause earned us nothing. I [00:47] think theou was a mistake back in April. [00:49] I was advocating back in April that what [00:50] we actually should do is we should bomb [00:52] their oil refineries on Kar Island. bomb [00:54] south powers, destroy their capacity to [00:57] pump and refine and then say to the [00:59] Saudis, UAE, Bahrain, and Israel, you [01:01] guys have oversight now. Enjoy. [01:03] That's what I thought was the solution. [01:05] >> Yeah. Um, [01:09] had we bombed their oil fields, wouldn't [01:11] they have bombed the UAE, Saudi Arabia, [01:14] all their energy, too? [01:15] >> Uh, that was that was what they were [01:16] threatening to do. And by the way, they [01:17] already have done some of that. And the [01:19] answer to that is yes. That is called [01:20] the cost of war. And if what it means [01:21] that Iran is unable to recover [01:23] economically, then Iran is unable to [01:25] recover economically. I was unaware that [01:26] war is a completely anodine enterprise. [01:29] I mean, I will say that I'm kind of [01:30] astonished in a certain way by the by [01:32] the attribution of great loss to the [01:35] United States in this war, given the [01:37] fact that any comparative effort by the [01:40] United States in literally all of our [01:42] history, this amounts to a drop in the [01:44] bucket in terms of cost. Again, that's [01:46] not to pretend there's no cause, but if [01:47] we're going to pretend that the United [01:49] States expending fads or that the United [01:53] States having higher gas prices is [01:55] somehow equivalent to the kind of [01:56] sacrifices the United States has [01:58] undergone in conflicts past, that [01:59] obviously is is historically inaccurate. [02:02] >> My name is Molly. I just wanted to ask [02:04] you a couple questions. Um, I believe in [02:06] doing, as you said, having courage, and [02:08] as you said, having courage has [02:09] sometimes political costs and all that. [02:11] Um, so what I'd like to ask you is, um, [02:15] as you're well aware, we've got a pretty [02:16] heated governor race going on right now [02:18] here in Iowa between Democrat candidate [02:20] Rob Sand and Republican candidate Zack [02:22] Lane. Um, I've actually just got two [02:25] questions. Number one, I was wondering [02:26] if you would endorse Zack Lane now in [02:28] the general election. Um, and although I [02:31] know your stance on foreign policy, um, [02:34] I was just wondering, again, I mean this [02:36] very respectfully, but just as a [02:38] question, um, how come you deny Charlie [02:41] Kirk changing his views towards the end [02:43] when there's videos out there of him, [02:44] you know, on the PBD podcast, Patrick [02:47] BetDavid podcast towards the end, [02:49] talking about um, him starting to have [02:51] questions or oppose his stance. Um, [02:54] yeah, I was just wondering kind of what [02:56] your thoughts are on that. essentially [02:58] will you endorse Sacklane now and [03:00] respectfully um why do you deny um and [03:03] just ad [03:05] yeah I got the questions and thank again [03:07] thank you for respectfully asking them [03:08] so we can have a conversation uh the [03:10] answer to the first one is yes of course [03:12] I'll endorse Zack Lane over the Democrat [03:16] and as as as for the second question [03:20] I've actually never argued ever that [03:23] Charlie and I saw eye to eye in [03:24] everything with regard to Israel or that [03:26] Charlie didn't have evolving views news [03:27] on, for example, America's relationship [03:30] with regard to Israel with respect to [03:32] Iran. I mean, I think that that what [03:34] Charlie said is public record. You can [03:35] look up everything that Charlie said, [03:37] and I don't feel the need to [03:37] characterize Charlie's views in any way. [03:39] I have my own views. Those views [03:40] predated Charlie. I'm a little older [03:42] than Charlie. And so, I've never felt [03:43] the necessity to to claim anything about [03:46] Charlie's views that you can't look up [03:47] yourself. You know, the the reality [03:50] again is that Charlie remains to the end [03:52] of his life, and this is something that [03:53] everyone knows widely speaking, pro- [03:56] Israel. That doesn't mean that he and I [03:57] saw eye to eye on everything with regard [03:59] to American policy with regard to Israel [04:01] or Israeli policy with regard to the [04:02] Middle East. I think all that's fair. [04:05] Charlie lived and died a pro-Israel [04:07] person. It is also true that Charlie and [04:10] I had, I would say, substantial [04:11] disagreements about uh you his views of [04:14] what Israel should do with regard to [04:16] Iran, what America should do with regard [04:18] to Israel. The truth actually is that I [04:20] was advocating for America and Israel to [04:21] end their memorandum of understanding [04:23] with regard to foreign aid long before [04:24] Charlie was. I I've been arguing that [04:26] for about 20 years, so I'm I'm kind of [04:28] first on that bandwagon. But again, I I [04:31] see no reason. This is one area where I [04:32] just I won't do it. I'm not going to [04:34] characterize the views of a person who's [04:35] a public figure, and you can look up all [04:37] of his views yourself. I feel no [04:38] necessity to, you know, recast anyone's [04:41] views. Just go look at what he had to [04:42] say. Today, I was coming to your uh to [04:46] push back just a little bit. Um, so [04:49] been kind of paying attention a little [04:50] bit with the Israel uh issue over uh [04:53] kind of with the uh genocide that [04:55] they're basically committing against the [04:57] uh Palestinian people and the Lebanese [04:59] people. But my problem kind of with that [05:01] is is when I start to look at the [05:02] reports of uh the children that are [05:06] dying and I assume that this room is a [05:07] very pro-life room. So kind of when I [05:10] look at that and I see children under [05:12] the age of uh 12 dying, that's kind of a [05:15] concern for me. Uh so basically kind of [05:18] where I'm going at with that there's a [05:20] lot of reports showing that basically [05:22] with the death toll of UNICEF basically [05:25] releasing with the Israel um basically [05:28] genocide against uh the Palestinian [05:30] people and the Lebanese people um it's [05:33] about I think 62% [05:36] of what they have found from a 22,000 uh [05:41] children under the age of 17 but with [05:44] that 62% [05:47] of that is under the age of 12. So [05:52] >> is there a question mark at the end of [05:53] this? Cuz [05:53] >> Yes. Yeah. [05:56] >> What initiates what is a citizen to the [06:01] Israeli people? So when [06:04] if they are going to attack someone that [06:08] they might think that is Hamas, what [06:10] would consider that for someone that is [06:13] under the age of 12 perhaps? [06:15] >> So okay, so he so number one use the [06:18] word genocide incorrectly there because [06:20] genocide is a word with a definition. [06:21] Genocide is the attempt to exterminate [06:23] in whole or in part a population on the [06:27] basis of their status as a member of the [06:28] population. Had Israel wanted to [06:30] genocide the Palestinians in Gaza, it [06:32] certainly had the capacity to do so. It [06:33] had complete air superiority throughout [06:35] the Gaza Strip, it could have leveled [06:37] those buildings, not while they were [06:39] empty, but with the people inside. [06:40] Instead, Israel went doortodoor at the [06:42] cost of literally thousands of its own [06:44] troops. I know some of those people who [06:46] had limbs blown off going door todo [06:47] attempting to be meticulous in their [06:49] pursuit of all of this. In fact, I was [06:51] talking with a friend who lives in [06:52] Israel right now. He's a surgeon at [06:54] Shyenk Hospital and right now he is [06:56] currently operating on a terrorist. They [06:59] brought in a terrorist who attempted to [07:00] kill some people in Jerusalem. He was [07:02] shot in the attempt and he is currently [07:04] in a hospital in Jerusalem being healed [07:05] by my Jewish friend doctor at Chariotic [07:07] Hospital. The idea that the IDF [07:09] perpetrated some sort of genocide in [07:11] Gaza belies every fact. It belies every [07:13] study ever done with regard to these [07:15] statistics of war. Israel in fact is [07:17] fighting the most meticulous war in the [07:19] most difficult circumstances in the [07:20] history of urban combat. It comes along [07:22] with significant civilian casualties [07:24] specifically because kamas hides behind [07:26] children. Now here is the thing. What [07:28] would get you, seriously, what would get [07:30] you as a human to hide behind your kids? [07:33] Okay, I just like I have five children. [07:35] There's literally nothing on earth. [07:37] There's not a single thing that could [07:38] ever happen on planet Earth that would [07:40] cause me in a military conflict to hide [07:43] behind my children. It is my job to [07:46] protect my children. They are hiding [07:48] behind their children for one reason and [07:49] one reason only. Okay? There's only one [07:52] reason and that reason is because is an [07:55] it is an effective tool at deterring the [07:58] Israelis from killing that many of them. [08:00] Okay? If the if if I knew if let's say I [08:03] were a terrorist and let's say that I [08:04] knew that the other side didn't care [08:05] about killing my kids, I wouldn't hide [08:06] behind my kids cuz my kids are going to [08:07] get blown away. But if I know that if I [08:10] hide behind kids, the Israelis will not [08:11] fire on me, then maybe I hide behind [08:13] kids, which is precisely why they hid [08:15] their headquarters in a hospital. It's [08:17] why they hide their weapons in schools. [08:18] It's why they hide their weapons in [08:19] mosques. It's why they build terror [08:20] tunnels below apartment buildings. It's [08:22] why they did all of this sort of stuff. [08:24] I mean, the simple fact of the matter is [08:26] that the inapplicability of the term [08:28] genocide to the situation is not only a [08:30] vile slur against Israelis, it's a vile [08:32] slur against logic. As far as the death [08:35] toll here, the reality is that as you [08:38] say, an enormous number of people under [08:40] a particular age have died. It's good [08:42] that you It's [08:43] >> Yes. Yes. Okay. Okay, the the assuming [08:47] assume assuming the Hamas statistics are [08:49] true because again the Gaza Ministry of [08:50] Health is Hamas. Some of those are they [08:52] basically categorized every death in [08:54] Gaza during this period including [08:55] certain natural deaths as death from the [08:57] war. But fine, let's use whatever [08:59] statistics are available. I'm glad that [09:01] you broke out the stat between below 17 [09:04] and then below like young childhood [09:05] because those are not the same thing. [09:06] What you actually see [09:07] >> and when you have a child that is under [09:10] the age of 12, is that Hamas? I mean I [09:14] don't think that it is because it's a [09:15] child under the age of Well, so if you [09:17] have like a child that is maybe 2 or 3 [09:19] years old, is that Hamas to have a [09:22] sniper from shoot them right in the head [09:25] to have their brother or sister carry [09:27] them back to their family? [09:29] >> Excuse me. I'm not making I'm not making [09:30] the argument I I didn't make the [09:32] argument that a child under the age of [09:33] 12 is Hamas. I will make the argument [09:35] that there are many many people in the [09:36] Gaza Strip over the age of 14 to 17 who [09:39] are Hamas affiliated because that [09:40] happens to be the fact. Unfortunately, [09:42] in war zones all over the world, there [09:43] are young teenagers who are armed up [09:45] with weaponry and then sent out to fight [09:46] by people who are older and and evil and [09:49] do that all the time. Again, the the [09:51] reality of war in urban combat [09:53] environments, you can ask soldiers from [09:54] America who fought in Iraq or who fought [09:56] in Afghanistan. Terrorists routinely [09:58] hide behind children. They do this [10:01] because they know what the consequences [10:03] will be. The way that it works in [10:04] Israel, because I have seen the tape of [10:06] drone strikes occurring in Israel, the [10:08] way that they go through is there are [10:09] four separate levels of legal authority [10:11] that must be cleared before any drone [10:13] strike actually takes place in any [10:15] place. Okay? Which means there's [10:17] enormous amounts of film of the Israelis [10:18] not calling in a drone strike when they [10:20] believe that the collateral damage is [10:21] too high. Okay? So again, no one is [10:24] going to argue that war isn't hideous [10:25] and ugly and horrifying. Every one of [10:28] those deaths is on Hamas. [10:29] >> I'm a government major and I have a [10:30] question pertaining to your thoughts on [10:32] Israel. You have long denied that what [10:34] is currently happening in Gaza could [10:35] constitute a genoc a genocide partially [10:37] due to a lack of intent. But I would [10:39] like to ask how does pelting a [10:40] 5-year-old Hin Rajab with 355 bullets [10:42] while she was trapped in a burning car [10:44] surrounded by her dead family members on [10:46] the phone from emergency services and [10:47] then subsequently killing the emergency [10:49] aid workers who came to help her not [10:51] demonstrate an intent to massacre. [10:53] >> Okay, so number one that is a certainly [10:56] that particular situation is under heavy [10:58] dispute from the IDF. So using the [11:00] Palestinian narrative on that without [11:02] seeing the IDF counter narrative and [11:03] again I'm not sure the fact pattern has [11:05] been established beyond a reasonable [11:06] doubt. I'm not sure that that that [11:08] answers the question. Beyond that, let's [11:10] assume for a second that all of that's [11:12] true. Okay, let's assume that all of [11:13] those accusations are true. To pretend [11:15] that individual war crimes, which is [11:17] what that would be, that an individual [11:18] war crime is indicative of the entirety [11:21] of a war effort would be to ignore the [11:22] entire history and context of every war [11:24] in the history of civilization. To [11:26] pretend that no war crimes exist in any [11:28] war and that any war crime therefore [11:31] justifies a charge of genocide is [11:33] insanity. The notion that what is [11:36] happening in the Gaza Strip, [11:40] the notion that what's happening in the [11:41] Gaza Strip is a genocide is belied by [11:44] every single fact. And what I mean by [11:46] that is that in order for there to be a [11:48] genocide, you would have to, for [11:49] example, demonstrate that Israel was [11:51] attempting to exterminate an entire [11:52] population as opposed to moving gigantic [11:55] swaths of civilians from particular [11:57] areas, heavily urbanized areas that were [11:59] being used by Hamas in order to protect [12:02] themselves from Israeli retaliation. You [12:05] would have to explain why it is that [12:06] Israeli soldiers were going door to door [12:08] and having their limbs blown off by [12:09] literally the thousands, I know many of [12:11] them, in order to not kill Palestinian [12:14] civilians. You'd have to explain why [12:15] Israel shipped in 2 million tons of egg. [12:17] You'd have to explain why Israel gave a [12:19] million polio shots. You'd have to [12:21] explain why it is that the Palestinian [12:24] population [12:26] is effectively the same size today [12:29] thanks to birth rate as it was before [12:31] the Gaza war. None of that looks like a [12:33] genocide. There's literally been no war [12:36] that has been fought in an urban terrain [12:38] of this magnitude that has a better and [12:41] there's no such thing as good obviously [12:42] but that has a more effective civilian [12:45] to terrorist kill ratio and using using [12:48] Hamas statistics calling that a genocide [12:50] you have to call literally every war [12:51] that's ever been fought a genocide. So [12:52] if you want to do that then you just [12:54] have to get rid of the word genocide. It [12:55] doesn't mean anything. And citing [12:56] individual instances even if you were [12:58] going to say that the Hindrahab [12:59] situation went down exactly the way [13:01] Palestinians say it did that would still [13:02] not answer the question. [13:04] response. [13:10] >> So this notion that Hin Rajab being [13:12] massacred is only a Palestinian [13:14] narrative is actually disproved. The IDF [13:15] admitted that they shot at Henrajab and [13:17] the emergency aid workers even though [13:18] the PCRS and the Gaza Health ministry [13:20] coordinated with the Israeli military to [13:22] let in passage to get rescue to Hinri, [13:25] but they subsequently shot her. They [13:26] first said that oh we didn't do that. we [13:28] weren't this we weren't operating in the [13:30] area but then video audio recording came [13:31] out of her phone call with the emergency [13:33] services and they were like yes we did [13:34] shoot her we did shoot the the aid [13:36] workers and then we're running [13:37] investigation sorry can you please let [13:39] me finish okay sorry um also also [13:44] >> it's Listen I let you ramble for like 5 [13:47] minutes can you please let me finish [13:48] okay [13:51] >> honestly it's guys guys seriously it's [13:54] okay go ahead but like come to [13:56] >> cuz you've said a lot of things I want [13:57] to I want to address all of them. Okay. [13:58] >> Well, I I would prefer you not address [14:00] like the entirety of the speech because [14:01] there are other people who want to ask [14:02] questions, but I'm happy to answer your [14:04] question. And I and again, I'm I'm [14:05] perfectly willing to acknowledge that [14:08] the IDF originally said they weren't in [14:09] the area and then admitted that they [14:11] were in the area. [14:11] >> So, why did they lie? Why did they lie [14:13] on multiple occasions including the the [14:14] killing of the 15 Palestinian aid [14:16] workers and also the shooting of a UN? [14:18] >> Okay. First, okay, now now can I answer [14:20] your question because you did hit a [14:21] question mark at the end of that [14:22] sentence. [14:22] >> Okay, go ahead. [14:23] >> Okay, thank you. I appreciate it. So the [14:24] the actual answer is that Israel has to [14:26] do a full-scale investigation of every [14:28] single one of these incidents while [14:29] Hamas simply claims a human rights [14:30] atrocity anytime anyone gets killed. And [14:32] so it takes a lot of time for Israel to [14:33] respond to every one of these charges. [14:36] Beyond which Israel the IDF still did [14:38] not suggest the IDF certainly did not [14:41] suggest that they purposely targeted aid [14:42] workers. What they suggested is that [14:44] there was error in the targeting of the [14:45] aid workers because it turns out that [14:47] Hamas frequently masquerades as aid [14:49] workers while pursuing terror [14:50] activities. That is just a real fact. [14:53] 88% of the 52 alleged war crimes into [14:56] Gaza have been investigated by Israel [14:58] have yielded no results or are stalled. [15:00] And the biggest punishment ever given to [15:02] an IDF soldier was 18 months. And in [15:05] like 2009 to 2008 or sometime around so [15:09] that that's okay. Let's assume all [15:10] that's okay. For the sake of argument, [15:12] let's assume that everything you're [15:13] saying is true. What is the greatest [15:14] penalty that's ever been given to say a [15:17] Hamas terrorist for openly murdering the [15:19] civilians, including children, and then [15:21] bringing them down? According [15:26] to you and Israeli officials, the [15:28] sentence for [15:30] >> according to the UN, [15:32] >> according to the UN, there's a genocide [15:34] going on in Gaza. That is according to [15:35] the UN commission. According according [15:36] to that, NICJ could never establish a [15:39] genocide. [15:40] >> Yes, they have. They have genocide [15:41] multiple times. [15:42] >> We again, we we could go back and forth [15:44] like this all night. I will just say the [15:46] UN is the mostly of international [15:48] organizations. It is staffed by [15:49] tyrannies and dictatorships. It's the [15:51] most evil states on planet Earth. And I [15:53] could not give it is not possible for me [15:55] to give less of a what Yemen says [15:57] is a genocide in the United Nations. [16:00] >> This reminds me of prime Ben Shapiro. [16:02] And I've said it before, I'll say it [16:04] again. He needs to do this more often. [16:06] He needs to get back to what made him [16:08] great, which is going on campus speaking [16:11] to students. You know, exactly what [16:13] Charlie Kirk uh I wouldn't say took from [16:16] him, but kind of adapted into his own [16:18] thing. you know, he he was known for the [16:20] free speech guy, but if you go back 5 10 [16:22] years, this was Ben Shapiro's thing. You [16:25] know, he this is how he became big. And [16:28] for some reason, he abandoned it. And [16:29] yes, his show has been very popular, but [16:32] I think he needs to get back to this. I [16:33] think he needs to get back on campus in [16:36] person and do kind of the grassroots [16:39] thing that he did back in the day. Now, [16:41] obviously, there are security issues. [16:43] you know, he has a family and, you know, [16:44] maybe maybe it is not his time, you [16:47] know, to to go and do this, but somebody [16:49] uh, you know, and my friend Cam Higgby [16:51] is going out on campus all the time. You [16:54] know, people like that are so much [16:56] stronger because those clips were get [16:58] will get shared a million times over. [17:00] It's not just uh a news article. You're [17:02] not just covering a news piece. You're [17:04] actually going making the content that [17:06] other people are then commenting on. And [17:09] the the distribution is insane. That's [17:12] what I would say. And I think Ben [17:13] Shapiro needs to get back to that if he [17:15] could. Or at least the Daily Wire needs [17:18] to find somebody else that can. Thank [17:20] you for watching and I'll see you in the [17:23] next
